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Jay Cutler acts like he's better than everyone around him, which is the dictionary definition of smug:
"contentedly confident of one's ability, superiority, or correctness;"
I don't see him acting any more superior than any other QB in the league. The difference between Jay and Aaron is that Aaron is known for over celebrating, which is very smug. The whole stupid championship discount double check belt bs is ridiculous and smug. I've never seen Jay get super excited over anything, he always seems to not care, which is why a lot of Bears fans dislike him. Is Jay roostery? Sure, not any different from any starting QB in the league.
None of that really matters though, if we can get some defense, preferably younger and not injured, Da Bears have a legit shot at going all the way. Jay Cutler has what it takes to win, plain and simple.
I agreed with you until you said he has what it takes to win.
Post by Longtime and Frequent Poster on Jan 6, 2014 12:29:53 GMT -5
Cutler hasn't had the same OC/Offense in back-to-back years in Chicago yet and has a crazy good receiver tandem. He's better than he's shown in his five years as a Bear, but he also isn't going to miraculously become a Top-8 QB in his age 31 season or anything.
And it's probably hard to be unbiased as a Packer fan, but I don't really see Rodgers being smug. At all. He started doing the championship belt in practice as a backup when he'd score against the first team defense and now it's turned into him starring in the worst commercials in history. It's just Bears fans having an inferiority complex, which is fine, cause my FB feed was riddled with "LOL at least we're still better than the Bears!!" comments after last night which is equally moronic.
I don't see him acting any more superior than any other QB in the league. The difference between Jay and Aaron is that Aaron is known for over celebrating, which is very smug. The whole stupid championship discount double check belt bs is ridiculous and smug. I've never seen Jay get super excited over anything, he always seems to not care, which is why a lot of Bears fans dislike him. Is Jay roostery? Sure, not any different from any starting QB in the league.
None of that really matters though, if we can get some defense, preferably younger and not injured, Da Bears have a legit shot at going all the way. Jay Cutler has what it takes to win, plain and simple.
I agreed with you until you said he has what it takes to win.
Before this season Jay hasn't really had a legit shot at winning. He's had a number of terrible offensive coaches all under a defensive minded head coach. He was sacked more times than any QB in the league. Despite all of this, in his second year with the Bears in 2010 he took them to the NFC championship game where he got hurt and had to leave. The very next year he had the Bears off to a 7-3 start before getting hurt. The team lost 5 of the next 6 games without him. Last year the Bears went 10-6, which in most years is enough to go to the playoffs. This year Cutler got hurt again, twice actually, but was still doing enough to win, that is if our defense wasn't god awful. In the game against GB he had a QB rating of 148 before throwing that Hail Mary pass at the end of the game that got intercepted.
This was the first season under Marc Trestman. The Bears were #2 in offense behind only the Broncos who broke a bunch of offensive records this season. Trestman is a brilliant Offensive coach who will get the best outta Jay, which is yet to be seen. He's gotten the best out of every QB he's ever coached, including turning Rich Gannon into an MVP QB. The only thing I'm slightly worried about is Jay being injury prone. If he plays 16 games this year, we're gonna see some MVP type numbers. Not to mention the offensive line is young and should improve every game they play.
One last stat, Jay Cutler is one the most clutch QB's in the league putting up one of the highest 4th quarter QB ratings at 102.7 and is also in the top 10 for game winning drives.
The difference between Jay and Aaron is that Aaron is known for over celebrating
There's also that talent thing.
Jay Cutler has all the talent in the world, he's never had a good coaching staff before now. Between the two, obviously Rodgers has been much more successful, but Rodgers has had continuity. Next season I'll bet Jay will be as good or at least close to it in every passing stat as Aaron barring any injuries.
Jay Cutler has all the talent in the world, he's never had a good coaching staff before now. Between the two, obviously Rodgers has been much more successful, but Rodgers has had continuity. Next season I'll bet Jay will be as good or at least close to it in every passing stat as Aaron barring any injuries.
He played his entire career up until this point under Lovie Smith and Mike Shanahan. Let's stop the rhetoric, please.
Jay Cutler has all the talent in the world, he's never had a good coaching staff before now. Between the two, obviously Rodgers has been much more successful, but Rodgers has had continuity. Next season I'll bet Jay will be as good or at least close to it in every passing stat as Aaron barring any injuries.
He played his entire career up until this point under Lovie Smith and Mike Shanahan. Let's stop the rhetoric, please.
besides his first three years in Denver, Jay has had 4 different offensive coordinators, Ron Turner, Mike Martz, Mike Tice, and now Aaron Kromer. These are facts.
besides his first three years in Denver, Jay has had 4 different offensive coordinators, Ron Turner, Mike Martz, Mike Tice, and now Aaron Kromer. These are facts.
I love that you link to the single worst football website on the internet. Not even fan-run blogs for the Raiders can out-do the flaming sh*tpile that is PFT.
When do things start becoming the fault of the QB? You know, the guy you just gave the richest contract ever to? When do his interceptions, his derps, his fumbles, his misplays, and so on...when do they become his fault? His OC's aren't the ones forcing him to try and gun it into triple coverage, and he only became an above-average player once he had a top-5 RB, top-5 WR, top 20 WR and a beast TE. So you tell me when we can start grading Hay Cutler on his play, I'd like to mark that date on my calendar.
besides his first three years in Denver, Jay has had 4 different offensive coordinators, Ron Turner, Mike Martz, Mike Tice, and now Aaron Kromer. These are facts.
I love that you link to the single worst football website on the internet. Not even fan-run blogs for the Raiders can out-do the flaming sh*tpile that is PFT.
When do things start becoming the fault of the QB? You know, the guy you just gave the richest contract ever to? When do his interceptions, his derps, his fumbles, his misplays, and so on...when do they become his fault? His OC's aren't the ones forcing him to try and gun it into triple coverage, and he only became an above-average player once he had a top-5 RB, top-5 WR, top 20 WR and a beast TE. So you tell me when we can start grading Hay Cutler on his play, I'd like to mark that date on my calendar.
Lol on the PFT. just an example of what was going on in the Bears organization the last few years.
Take a look around the league at so called "above average" or even "elite" QB's who have ups and downs. You have guys like Flacco, who is getting paid more per year by 2 million, shit the bed this year. Look at how Eli did this year? All the years under Lovie are thrown out the window. No QB will ever have a shot under that guy, he's purely defense. I can't wait to see the numbers the TB QB puts up next season.
The most important player on the team having to learn a new system every year is going to end badly, every year. The first few seasons, Cutlers top WR was a DB/return specialist. The WR's created a lot of those INT's by running the wrong routes, Knox was famous for it. The offensive line is very important, just ask Eli Manning. Cutler was hurried a lot and sacked more than any QB in those first 4 years. So when you don't have any weapons or an O-line, it's not hard to figure out the outcome. Of course he's gonna take chances, he doesn't want to hold on to the ball or he's gonna get planted again.
This was Jeffrey's second season and the first year with Bennett at TE. We now have an offensive minded coach, who knows how to use Forte properly. Cutler is still learning the system, the system that McCown has played in his whole life, which is part of the reason he had success. Cutler will get better every year with Trestman. My only concern is the defense. Emery has shown that he can turn around an offense, but so far his defensive picks haven't panned out. They're gonna be cutting a lot of big names in the offseason, like Peppers and Tillman, should be interesting who they get to replace them.
To answer your question, I'll start grading Cutler this year. He was ranked 6th in Total QBR before getting hurt against Washington, and finished 8th. IMO, Total QBR is much better than the old passer rating system. So finishing 8th isn't a bad start. If it wasn't for a terrible defense, they might've won 3-4 more games.
I love that you link to the single worst football website on the internet. Not even fan-run blogs for the Raiders can out-do the flaming sh*tpile that is PFT.
When do things start becoming the fault of the QB? You know, the guy you just gave the richest contract ever to? When do his interceptions, his derps, his fumbles, his misplays, and so on...when do they become his fault? His OC's aren't the ones forcing him to try and gun it into triple coverage, and he only became an above-average player once he had a top-5 RB, top-5 WR, top 20 WR and a beast TE. So you tell me when we can start grading Hay Cutler on his play, I'd like to mark that date on my calendar.
IMO, Total QBR is much better than the old passer rating system.
theres a lot of great points as to why total QBR is better than the passer rating system.
ESPN recently created and instituted a new quarterback rating system that they coined the Total Quarterback Rating (TQR). This complex model could very well serve as the new standard for judgement in the NFL field, perhaps replacing the popularly accepted Passer Rating, which has been used for the past few decades.
Where the Passer Rating formula only takes into account plays without considering the quarterback's teammates' efforts or the circumstances of a game, TQR allows for quarterbacks to be rated on every aspect of a passing play to establish their complete contributions to a game. For instance, on a pass play, all quarterbacks are given credit, labeled Dividing Credit, for what their teammates and receivers achieve on their part. This credit is broken down into four components: the pass protection, the throw, the catch and the run following the reception.
Other new factors come into play with TQR, such as Clutch Index, a 100-point scoring system as the new basis for rating (with 50 representing an average QB), and win probability and expected points. Also complementing the fundamentals behind a player's contribution to a win is the concept of defensive adjustment, and, when necessary, ESPN will consider opponent adjustment in discussions as well.
Regarding scoring and win expectations, ESPN explained,
"The goal behind any player rating should be determining how much a player contributes to a win. We went back through 10 years of NFL play-by-play data to look at game situation (down, distance, yard line, clock time, timeouts, home field, field surface and score), along with the ultimate outcome of the game, to develop a win probability function".
Well, one thing is for sure: rating passers without considering rushing yards, a QB's win-loss record, sacks, leadership, play-calling or other intangibles has certainly been growing less substantial as a statistic over the years. Also, no quarterback should be considered a completely perfect passer in a game, wherein 60 QB's in the NFL have achieved the perfect score of 158.3 (and seven have achieved this feat more than once). TQR seems to be much more accurate and effective in determining a passer's overall game contributions.
However, the new rating system is very subjective, and some factors are not entirely specified. This is based on the fact that anybody may review an important play or close game differently than others.
Whether or not the league decides to use TQR, quarterbacks will most likely feel unaffected by the number or value they are assigned.
After all, it is just a number, but it is also a grade for players' performances. The new system may even affect the way Fantasy Football data is collected and impact those leagues based on the introduction and usage of new criteria.
You're just too young to grasp how stylin' I really was. All the boys wanted to do me when I was 5. Actually the girls did too. My haircut was confusing.
theres a lot of great points as to why total QBR is better than the passer rating system.
ESPN recently created and instituted a new quarterback rating system that they coined the Total Quarterback Rating (TQR). This complex model could very well serve as the new standard for judgement in the NFL field, perhaps replacing the popularly accepted Passer Rating, which has been used for the past few decades.
Where the Passer Rating formula only takes into account plays without considering the quarterback's teammates' efforts or the circumstances of a game, TQR allows for quarterbacks to be rated on every aspect of a passing play to establish their complete contributions to a game. For instance, on a pass play, all quarterbacks are given credit, labeled Dividing Credit, for what their teammates and receivers achieve on their part. This credit is broken down into four components: the pass protection, the throw, the catch and the run following the reception.
Other new factors come into play with TQR, such as Clutch Index, a 100-point scoring system as the new basis for rating (with 50 representing an average QB), and win probability and expected points. Also complementing the fundamentals behind a player's contribution to a win is the concept of defensive adjustment, and, when necessary, ESPN will consider opponent adjustment in discussions as well.
Regarding scoring and win expectations, ESPN explained,
"The goal behind any player rating should be determining how much a player contributes to a win. We went back through 10 years of NFL play-by-play data to look at game situation (down, distance, yard line, clock time, timeouts, home field, field surface and score), along with the ultimate outcome of the game, to develop a win probability function".
Well, one thing is for sure: rating passers without considering rushing yards, a QB's win-loss record, sacks, leadership, play-calling or other intangibles has certainly been growing less substantial as a statistic over the years. Also, no quarterback should be considered a completely perfect passer in a game, wherein 60 QB's in the NFL have achieved the perfect score of 158.3 (and seven have achieved this feat more than once). TQR seems to be much more accurate and effective in determining a passer's overall game contributions.
However, the new rating system is very subjective, and some factors are not entirely specified. This is based on the fact that anybody may review an important play or close game differently than others.
Whether or not the league decides to use TQR, quarterbacks will most likely feel unaffected by the number or value they are assigned.
After all, it is just a number, but it is also a grade for players' performances. The new system may even affect the way Fantasy Football data is collected and impact those leagues based on the introduction and usage of new criteria.
Trent Dilfer came up with this so he could argue Tim Tebow as a starting quarterback. Go sit in the corner and think about what you've done.
The difference between Jay and Aaron is that Aaron is known for over celebrating
There's also that talent thing.
He has as much talent as Rodgers, Jay's problem is his decision making. He has to be smarter. Not saying he will change that, but if he can, with the weapons he now has, the ones that Lovie and Angelo DIDN'T give him, they will be a very dangerous team and an absolute Super Bowl contender.
Post by Mista Don't Play on Jan 6, 2014 19:09:09 GMT -5
Cutler hasn't had the greatest opportunities, he has disappointed at times to. I think the jury is still out. I've given him the benefit of the doubt because of a sh*tty o-line and being on defensive minded team over recent years, But that isn't the case anymore. The Bears have, arguably, the best set of offensive weapons in the NFL, so if that roster stays the same, next year is his chance to prove his worth. If you can't win and put up numbers with Jeffrey, Marshall, Forte, and Bennett, you can't do it with anyone.
Cutler hasn't had the greatest opportunities, he has disappointed at times to. I think the jury is still out. I've given him the benefit of the doubt because of a sh*tty o-line and being on defensive minded team over recent years, But that isn't the case anymore. The Bears have, arguably, the best set of offensive weapons in the NFL, so if that roster stays the same, next year is his chance to prove his worth. If you can't win and put up numbers with Jeffrey, Marshall, Forte, and Bennett, you can't do it with anyone.
Absolutely, his decision making has killed him. he tries to make throws that just aren't there instead of checking it down. He received the deal he got because the Bears had no other option, but the devil is in the details, and his deal is very club friendly. He is receiving all of his guaranteed money upfront, over the next three years. He's counting against the cap 22M in 2014, 15.5M in 2015, and 16M in 2016. So he has all the incentive in the world to perform. Unfortunately for him, if he doesn't perform, or if he is unable to stay healthy, which has been another one of his downfalls in recent years, then he's shit out of luck after 2016. The team can cut him at no cost against the cap. He also has a clause that states he has to play all 16 games in any one season to receive all the money he's contracted for that year. If he misses a game it comes out of his pay. So the Bears have essentially signed him to a three year deal with a 4 year club option. They will probably ink McCown for another year at least, maybe 2, giving them time to find a young QB in the draft if Cutty doesn't pan out. It was a good move by Phil Emery.
He has as much talent as Rodgers, Jay's problem is his decision making. He has to be smarter. Not saying he will change that, but if he can, with the weapons he now has, the ones that Lovie and Angelo DIDN'T give him, they will be a very dangerous team and an absolute Super Bowl contender.
Doesn't "decision making" factor in to "talent?" Or are you using "talent" as a very narrow descriptor which means "ability to throw a football with some combination of accuracy and velocity?" Because if you think that's all that "talent" is, then JaMarcus Russell has as much talent as Peyton Manning.
I use talent to describe his physical ability to play NFL football. He's got a rocket arm, very good accuracy, and can be very mobile when he has to. The way you mentally play the game is normally separate from the physical talent you possess.
He has as much talent as Rodgers, Jay's problem is his decision making. He has to be smarter. Not saying he will change that, but if he can, with the weapons he now has, the ones that Lovie and Angelo DIDN'T give him, they will be a very dangerous team and an absolute Super Bowl contender.
Doesn't "decision making" factor in to "talent?" Or are you using "talent" as a very narrow descriptor which means "ability to throw a football with some combination of accuracy and velocity?" Because if you think that's all that "talent" is, then JaMarcus Russell has as much talent as Peyton Manning.
Cutler hasn't had the greatest opportunities, he has disappointed at times to. I think the jury is still out. I've given him the benefit of the doubt because of a sh*tty o-line and being on defensive minded team over recent years, But that isn't the case anymore. The Bears have, arguably, the best set of offensive weapons in the NFL, so if that roster stays the same, next year is his chance to prove his worth. If you can't win and put up numbers with Jeffrey, Marshall, Forte, and Bennett, you can't do it with anyone.
Serious question: he's going to be 31 in April, how long does the jury deliberate for? When is he not just a QB with a cannon and a propensity for terrible decision making?
He's never going to be one of the greats. His numbers have been too average. But he has put up pro bowl numbers before and he has the impact play ability that Bears have been looking for from a QB for decades. That's what the Bears are hoping to get out of him. The jury is in. He is an average to above average qb, but that doesn't mean you can't win a Super Bowl with him, and he can't put up a 4k yrd, 30 td, 10 int year. That's what your hoping for from him.
Cutler hasn't had the greatest opportunities, he has disappointed at times to. I think the jury is still out. I've given him the benefit of the doubt because of a sh*tty o-line and being on defensive minded team over recent years, But that isn't the case anymore. The Bears have, arguably, the best set of offensive weapons in the NFL, so if that roster stays the same, next year is his chance to prove his worth. If you can't win and put up numbers with Jeffrey, Marshall, Forte, and Bennett, you can't do it with anyone.
Serious question: he's going to be 31 in April, how long does the jury deliberate for? When is he not just a QB with a cannon and a propensity for terrible decision making?
He gets next season. This season would have been the one to judge him on if not for the injury. I put him in the "good enough to win" but not good enough to shoulder a team category, fwiw.
Serious question: he's going to be 31 in April, how long does the jury deliberate for? When is he not just a QB with a cannon and a propensity for terrible decision making?
He gets next season. This season would have been the one to judge him on if not for the injury. I put him in the "good enough to win" but not good enough to shoulder a team category, fwiw.
I have him in the same category, and I think the season after he lands the biggest deal ever is all he gets, also.
He has one of the top three or four skill groups to work with, draft him a non-sh*tty OL (or sign one) and if he doesn't make the playoffs Beavdog has to wear an Aaron Rodgers jersey every Sunday the following season.
So rumor has it around town that Bill O'Brien is interested in Patriots backup QB Ryan Mallet. Makes sense, O'Brien was the coordinator when Mallet was there, so if anyone has seen what he can do its O'Brien. Realistically we'd probably have to give up a 3rd round pick, but we wouldn't have to pay him big starter money. I'm not to knowledgable on Ryan Mallet. Does this sound reasonable or are the Texans fucking up again ?
You're just too young to grasp how stylin' I really was. All the boys wanted to do me when I was 5. Actually the girls did too. My haircut was confusing.
So rumor has it around town that Bill O'Brien is interested in Patriots backup QB Ryan Mallet. Makes sense, O'Brien was the coordinator when Mallet was there, so if anyone has seen what he can do its O'Brien. Realistically we'd probably have to give up a 3rd round pick, but we wouldn't have to pay him big starter money. I'm not to knowledgable on Ryan Mallet. Does this sound reasonable or are the Texans fucking up again ?
If the Texans passed on Teddy B and instead traded for Ryan Mallet to be their QB....that would be nothing short of a disaster. Like, franchise-altering disaster. The Texans just got over that "loser" label, bringing in and starting Mallet would be one of the quickest ways to get it back.
So rumor has it around town that Bill O'Brien is interested in Patriots backup QB Ryan Mallet. Makes sense, O'Brien was the coordinator when Mallet was there, so if anyone has seen what he can do its O'Brien. Realistically we'd probably have to give up a 3rd round pick, but we wouldn't have to pay him big starter money. I'm not to knowledgable on Ryan Mallet. Does this sound reasonable or are the Texans fucking up again ?
If the Texans passed on Teddy B and instead traded for Ryan Mallet to be their QB....that would be nothing short of a disaster. Like, franchise-altering disaster. The Texans just got over that "loser" label, bringing in and starting Mallet would be one of the quickest ways to get it back.
I could be wrong but I think he may be a free agent after the season, I think it's one of those situations as much the patriots would like him to be the "qb of the future" the time frame won't work out and they can't invest to much in a guy who won't be a starter til his 6th-8th year in the league. If he isn't a free agent I could totally see them trading him for a pick and in turn their new Brady successor.
If the Texans passed on Teddy B and instead traded for Ryan Mallet to be their QB....that would be nothing short of a disaster. Like, franchise-altering disaster. The Texans just got over that "loser" label, bringing in and starting Mallet would be one of the quickest ways to get it back.
I could be wrong but I think he may be a free agent after the season, I think it's one of those situations as much the patriots would like him to be the "qb of the future" the time frame won't work out and they can't invest to much in a guy who won't be a starter til his 6th-8th year in the league. If he isn't a free agent I could totally see them trading him for a pick and in turn their new Brady successor.
Edit: I'm wrong 1 more year
He's got another year. O'Brien will also have derpypoops Mike Lombardi to compete with for Mallett's services. Lombardi would scoop up Bill Belichick's sh*t off the ground, eat it and tell you it's better than Godiva chocolate. What a worthless putz of a human being.
Edit: You must have edited as I clicked "quote," whoops
I was afraid of that. I guess the thought behind that is that Bridgewater isn't a clear #1 like Andrew Luck. It's just the idea of trading for a backup QB to be our starter didn't exactly work out last time. Matt Schaub wasn't a complete failure for us. He produced pro bowl numbers, but he never had the "it" factor to will his team to win. Theres no way of knowing if Ryan Mallet has the ability to be a starter in the NFL, but I guess if O'Brien is even thinking about it then he must have seen something in him while he was in New England. Interesting enough Jay Gruden wanted the Bengals to draft Ryan Mallet instead of Andy Dalton but got out voted, so if Jay Gruden happens to leave the Bengals which he's rumored to be on several teams wishlist then Ryan Mallet may be somewhat in demand. I guess that fact that Jay Gruden & Bill O'Brien show interest in Ryan Mallet is something in itself. Also if we get a QB outside the draft, the idea of Watt & Clowny makes me wet.
You're just too young to grasp how stylin' I really was. All the boys wanted to do me when I was 5. Actually the girls did too. My haircut was confusing.