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Praying for families of victims, injured, emergency responders, and others providing aid and care. Tragic. A lot of people just out for a concert or dinner and this happens. A lot of mixed news and confusion. Hope they catch the evil people that did this.
Post by mymirrorlies on Nov 15, 2015 5:04:36 GMT -5
I feel so strange about attending future concerts now, it makes me quite nervous. Those young people were held hostage for hours and picked off one by one, and for what? Allah-****ing Akbar? I'm not generalizing though, these are a small cult of Muslim extremists that I hope gets their ass' handed to them by the French. And by that I mean war.
Not sure I can call millions following the call of Jihad for hundreds of years "small". These people are actively pursuing a global world war in every country in the world-and are growing their Caliphate despite the "efforts" of the US and its allies. I pray people will wake up. My friend sent me a photo of the first wave of mostly Muslim men arriving in New Orleans from Syria. Who is making sure they are not jihadis? Answer...nobody. One of the Paris terrorist-murderers was a Syrian refugee. It is scary and agree with the call to dramatically change our point of view about open borders..
My friend sent me a photo of the first wave of mostly Muslim men arriving in New Orleans from Syria. Who is making sure they are not jihadis? Answer...nobody.
1. I'm guessing this is the photo:
It was taken in Hungary, not New Orleans. In reality, where the rest of us live, two families (6 people) have arrived in New Orleans from Syria.
2. Someone is making sure they're not jihadis. You honestly believe they're just picking up people off the streets of Syria and flying them off to America? Or are you just fear-mongering?
My friend sent me a photo of the first wave of mostly Muslim men arriving in New Orleans from Syria. Who is making sure they are not jihadis? Answer...nobody.
1. I'm guessing this is the photo:
It was taken in Hungary, not New Orleans. In reality, where the rest of us live, two families (6 people) have arrived in New Orleans from Syria.
2. Someone is making sure they're not jihadis. You honestly believe they're just picking up people off the streets of Syria and flying them off to America? Or are you just fear-mongering?
I'm pretty confident this will lead to western troops on the ground in Syria. I hate to say it, but Putin may have been right re: Assad and how to maintain stability in Syria.
My friend sent me a photo of the first wave of mostly Muslim men arriving in New Orleans from Syria. Who is making sure they are not jihadis? Answer...nobody.
2. Someone is making sure they're not jihadis. You honestly believe they're just picking up people off the streets of Syria and flying them off to America? Or are you just fear-mongering?
I am sure someone is TRYING to to make sure the refugees are not jihadis. But, the people who perpetrated these murders in France were carrying fake passports, and those would probably work here, too. The refugees are not being picked off the streets in Syria, they are already in Europe and in countries who will happily say they have been vetted to move them beyond their control. It's not as simple as just asking for a driver's license, but it can be done.
Our security efforts are largely successful, but the TSA managed to let 95% of test "bombs" slip past them when tested. If we double our efforts, we are still 90% at risk. Sadly, that will likely be the case any time our borders are crossed, but the US is still better than most countries I imagine.
It's a scary world, and I'm really troubled that these attackers chose something close to all of us as a target -- live music. That should be where you can relax, let down your guard, be free. That may not be the case any longer. It will be interesting to see how the festival world responds. At Bonnaroo, we have gotten at least a cursory search upon entering. At Firefly, we got a wave and a nod. But, I'm an old man with gray hair -- I'm only a threat to be grouchy. I would think they will have to up their security game a bit in coming days.
2. Someone is making sure they're not jihadis. You honestly believe they're just picking up people off the streets of Syria and flying them off to America? Or are you just fear-mongering?
I am sure someone is TRYING to to make sure the refugees are not jihadis. But, the people who perpetrated these murders in France were carrying fake passports, and those would probably work here, too. The refugees are not being picked off the streets in Syria, they are already in Europe and in countries who will happily say they have been vetted to move them beyond their control. It's not as simple as just asking for a driver's license, but it can be done.
Our security efforts are largely successful, but the TSA managed to let 95% of test "bombs" slip past them when tested. If we double our efforts, we are still 90% at risk. Sadly, that will likely be the case any time our borders are crossed, but the US is still better than most countries I imagine.
It's a scary world, and I'm really troubled that these attackers chose something close to all of us as a target -- live music. That should be where you can relax, let down your guard, be free. That may not be the case any longer. It will be interesting to see how the festival world responds. At Bonnaroo, we have gotten at least a cursory search upon entering. At Firefly, we got a wave and a nod. But, I'm an old man with gray hair -- I'm only a threat to be grouchy. I would think they will have to up their security game a bit in coming days.
Some 18,000 of these people — chosen because they are the most vulnerable whether through family circumstances, injury or disability — have been referred to the United States for resettlement.
Once the US State Department receives their case files it employs NGO contractors to pre-screen them for eligibility for refugee status, then they are subjected to health and security checks.
Officers from the Department of Homeland Security fly from Washington to the camps and conduct interviews with candidates, seeking to weed out what a US official called “liars, criminals and terrorists.”
Each case file is reviewed by the National Counterterrorism Center, the FBI’s terrorist screening center, the DHS, the Department of Defense and “other agencies” — US intelligence.
“Refugees are subject to the highest level of security checks of any category of traveler to the United States,” another State Department official told reporters.
Meanwhile they receive medical tests and those with communicable diseases, most commonly tuberculosis, are given treatment before they can travel to the United States, often delaying the process.
That's great. And TSA (part of Homeland Security) let in 95% of test bombs. 95 percent.
If they reversed their success rate and were successful 95% of the time, since this group of travelers undergoes the most intense scrutiny, then that is still 900 potential failures within that group of 18,000 refugees.
Don't get me wrong; those people need help. And they will benefit from coming to the United States. We need to do our part. But we should not be so quick to dispense caution as "fear-mongering." Our best systems are prone to failure, and we are going to have to test them with a group who may have no identification. An open heart and mind are great. But diligence is needed now, as well.
Not sure I can call millions following the call of Jihad for hundreds of years "small". These people are actively pursuing a global world war in every country in the world-and are growing their Caliphate despite the "efforts" of the US and its allies. I pray people will wake up. My friend sent me a photo of the first wave of mostly Muslim men arriving in New Orleans from Syria. Who is making sure they are not jihadis? Answer...nobody. One of the Paris terrorist-murderers was a Syrian refugee. It is scary and agree with the call to dramatically change our point of view about open borders..
Are you aware that only 6% of terror attacks on American soil were carried out by Muslims?
You want something to fear? Fear drunk drivers. Fear cancer. Fear pulmonary embolisms and the widening gap between the middle and upper class and fear Dick Cheney any time he holds a gun. Fear hurricanes and undiagnosed syphilis and the Hangout thread. Fear dying with words unsaid. Fear living an uneducated life where your opinions and beliefs are easily swayed by news headlines with emotional language targeted to capitalize on your lack of understanding. Educate yourself.
Don't fear terrorism. Don't fear Islam. Those fears are unfounded, and are unhelpful.
5.5/four tet, daphni b2b floating points, avalon emerson 5.12/neil young 5.19/mannequin pussy 5.21/serpentwithfeet 5.25/hozier 6.12-16/bonnaroo 6.28/goose 6.29/goose 9.17/the national + the war on drugs 9.23/sigur ros 9.27-29/making time 10.17/air
That's great. And TSA (part of Homeland Security) let in 95% of test bombs. 95 percent.
If they reversed their success rate and were successful 95% of the time, since this group of travelers undergoes the most intense scrutiny, then that is still 900 potential failures within that group of 18,000 refugees.
Don't get me wrong; those people need help. And they will benefit from coming to the United States. We need to do our part. But we should not be so quick to dispense caution as "fear-mongering." Our best systems are prone to failure, and we are going to have to test them with a group who may have no identification. An open heart and mind are great. But diligence is needed now, as well.
I don't really think the TSA is a fair comparison when it comes to the level of competency involved in screening, but I respect that you have a more nuanced opinion than "I saw a picture of brown people on brietbart.com and now I'm terrified to leave my house"
My friend sent me a photo of the first wave of mostly Muslim men arriving in New Orleans from Syria. Who is making sure they are not jihadis? Answer...nobody. One of the Paris terrorist-murderers was a Syrian refugee. It is scary and agree with the call to dramatically change our point of view about open borders..
Hmmm...well, following that line of reasoning, we should probably question every white Christian that tries to enter a new territory too, given how much destruction and death they've caused as a group over the centuries.
But yeah. You and Trump are the bright ones here. CLOSE THOSE BORDERS. KEEP 'MERICA SAFE. GOD BLESS.
Considering you've found the need to respond to my threads as if you are threatened by me I offer you some peace my confused counterpart. May you find peace in your restless soul.
Important and complex subject. Presidential candidates struggle to explain it and debate pros or cons of the alternatives. Some good discussion, and some opinion on here. Not sure we are going to solve the problem on Inforoo and agree to keep it civil. I'm bowing out of this discussion, but encourage everyone to do fact checks and listen to opposing opinions before making up your mind. Cheers and my offer to buy Inforooers a beer at Hangout fest is still good.
"Attacks like the ones tonight in Paris are committed to purposely trigger an Islamophobic backlash. That backlash is not an unintended consequence of such attacks, it is part of their logic. ISIS types want an Islamophobic backlash because it lends credence to their narrative that there is a war between the West and Islam. By strengthening and emboldening the xenophobic right-wing in Europe, they strengthen their own worldview as well. And the most tragic irony is that that backlash may target refugees who themselves had been fleeing ISIS' reign of terror."
"Attacks like the ones tonight in Paris are committed to purposely trigger an Islamophobic backlash. That backlash is not an unintended consequence of such attacks, it is part of their logic. ISIS types want an Islamophobic backlash because it lends credence to their narrative that there is a war between the West and Islam. By strengthening and emboldening the xenophobic right-wing in Europe, they strengthen their own worldview as well. And the most tragic irony is that that backlash may target refugees who themselves had been fleeing ISIS' reign of terror."
"Attacks like the ones tonight in Paris are committed to purposely trigger an Islamophobic backlash. That backlash is not an unintended consequence of such attacks, it is part of their logic. ISIS types want an Islamophobic backlash because it lends credence to their narrative that there is a war between the West and Islam. By strengthening and emboldening the xenophobic right-wing in Europe, they strengthen their own worldview as well. And the most tragic irony is that that backlash may target refugees who themselves had been fleeing ISIS' reign of terror."
I am certain that they leaders at ISIS will use a backlash to recruit. They would use a lack of a backlash to recruit. They will use anything to recruit.
The purpose of that attack was not to trigger a secondary or tertiary backlash. The purpose of the attack was to kill people.
"Attacks like the ones tonight in Paris are committed to purposely trigger an Islamophobic backlash. That backlash is not an unintended consequence of such attacks, it is part of their logic. ISIS types want an Islamophobic backlash because it lends credence to their narrative that there is a war between the West and Islam. By strengthening and emboldening the xenophobic right-wing in Europe, they strengthen their own worldview as well. And the most tragic irony is that that backlash may target refugees who themselves had been fleeing ISIS' reign of terror."
I am certain that they leaders at ISIS will use a backlash to recruit. They would use a lack of a backlash to recruit. They will use anything to recruit.
The purpose of that attack was not to trigger a secondary or tertiary backlash. The purpose of the attack was to kill people.
"Attacks like the ones tonight in Paris are committed to purposely trigger an Islamophobic backlash. That backlash is not an unintended consequence of such attacks, it is part of their logic. ISIS types want an Islamophobic backlash because it lends credence to their narrative that there is a war between the West and Islam. By strengthening and emboldening the xenophobic right-wing in Europe, they strengthen their own worldview as well. And the most tragic irony is that that backlash may target refugees who themselves had been fleeing ISIS' reign of terror."
What's that quote from? It's nice.
One of my old teachers posted it on Facebook actually. I couldn't think of a better way to put it so I just quoted it.
I work everyday with someone from Iraq. I have heard the horror stories of how they got here and why they came. I have watched and helped them embrace this country and all it has to offer. I have even exposed them to Kanye and Drake, for which they did not thank me. I 've learned so much from them. The food, the culture. How to cuss in Arabic. I have never felt fearful. Never felt my station or position in life was in any way deminished or threatened.
I understand the fear these attacks instill in us. I feel it as well. The key is to not let that fear cloud our judgement and make us blind to the fact that hate only propagates more hate.
"Attacks like the ones tonight in Paris are committed to purposely trigger an Islamophobic backlash. That backlash is not an unintended consequence of such attacks, it is part of their logic. ISIS types want an Islamophobic backlash because it lends credence to their narrative that there is a war between the West and Islam. By strengthening and emboldening the xenophobic right-wing in Europe, they strengthen their own worldview as well. And the most tragic irony is that that backlash may target refugees who themselves had been fleeing ISIS' reign of terror."
I am certain that they leaders at ISIS will use a backlash to recruit. They would use a lack of a backlash to recruit. They will use anything to recruit.
The purpose of that attack was not to trigger a secondary or tertiary backlash. The purpose of the attack was to kill people.
I think the attack had multiple purposes, and they likely achieved what they set out to accomplish.
5.5/four tet, daphni b2b floating points, avalon emerson 5.12/neil young 5.19/mannequin pussy 5.21/serpentwithfeet 5.25/hozier 6.12-16/bonnaroo 6.28/goose 6.29/goose 9.17/the national + the war on drugs 9.23/sigur ros 9.27-29/making time 10.17/air
I am certain that they leaders at ISIS will use a backlash to recruit. They would use a lack of a backlash to recruit. They will use anything to recruit.
The purpose of that attack was not to trigger a secondary or tertiary backlash. The purpose of the attack was to kill people.
What was the purpose of killing people?
Ceasing them from being. They can create a backlash by destroying things, too, as they have done. We give bad people too much credit when we try to assign politically expedient outcomes to vicious acts.
This is the same group who slaughtered entire towns of people just because they believed differently. They blew up an airliner full of people only a week ago. They launched six simultaneous attacks to kill as many people as possible.
What is the purpose? I don't think you need a purpose when you're in the business of killing. That quote is geared to help people here measure their response. I don't think the folks in ISIS care about our thoughts or feelings.
The attacks in Paris represent the absolute worst that humans are capable of doing to their own kind, just like 9/11 or any other terrorist attack. The bigger problem is much more complex than most people give credit for.
To defeat any enemy, I believe, you must understand the motivations driving their actions. If you do not, you risk playing right into their hand. We seem to be heading that way presently. As usual we have a situation where politics is keeping the rest of the world, that agrees ISIS must be stopped, from taking necessary actions to do so.
Understanding where their head is:
Baghdadi has been declared the Caliph, according to ISIS and their followers. But first consider this. Their goal is not a conventional one, where they seek to take over land to keep secure under their rule as a place to call their own and raise a family under strict sharia law. They have a very specific goal, it is to set in motion the apocalypse, plain and simple. There are extremely specific things that need to happen for this to come about. Many were confused when ISIS expended a lot of lives and energy to take the city of Dabiq in Syria. If you understand their goals, you know that this city is where, according to ISIS, is where the invading army will set up camp. The ISIS (or Islamic true believers) will meet them there and defeat them.
Step 1- Meet and defeat the invading non-muslim army at Dabiq
Step 2- After victory in Dabiq, they expand and sack the city of Istanbul.
Step 3- After taking Istanbul the anti-messiah or Dajjal, will come and slaughter most of the believers (ISIS) until only about 5,000 will remain. Cornered in, you guessed it, Jerusalem. (explains a lot of other things happening in the region)
Step 4- Jesus, the second most revered prophet in Islam, will return to lead the remaining true believers to victory.
Understanding this does a few things. One, setbacks are not really a big deal in the minds of ISIS. There are a few specific things they believe will happen and ultimately they will be almost totally wiped out anyway. Two, the people talking about how attacks in other countries are for "recruiting" are correct. This is all predicated on the prophecy, so ISIS can use backlash to strengthen their numbers to ultimately set in motion certain events.
Now, let's talk about Baghdadi and his role as Caliph. Here again there are very specific things he needs to do to maintain legitimacy as a Caliph.
1- He must implement total Sharia law (not a hybrid practiced in many parts of the Arab world) any deviation and he is done.
2- He is only permitted to accept temporary peace treaties, lasting no longer than a decade. He cannot recognize any official international borders. By belief, it is all theirs.
3- He must wage constant war in pursuit of their goals. There is not stopping.
They are extremely hamstrung by this ideology. There is no negotiation, there will never be a long lasting treaty to settle anything, and he cannot stop fighting. It is an interesting note that they believe there will be 12 Caliphs...Baghdadi is the 8th. All this also explains why there is a mutual hated between Al Queda and ISIS. Bin-Laden and Zarquawi came from high society muslim families, they never have pledged allegiance to ISIS...their goals differ slightly but significantly with Baghdadi in that they never believed the apocalypse will happen in their lifetime. Bin Ladens goal was to expel the west from Muslim lands, that was his major beef with the Western powers. That we were occupying and exploiting Muslim lands. He was correct....his methods were misguided and murderous though. He believed his actions were simply a precursor to the apocalyptic story that Baghdadi places himself in the middle of.
So, the question is how do we end this? I believe the answer is we take away Baghdadi's legitimacy. As stated above he needs to maintain some very specific criteria in the role of Caliph. One major one being he needs to maintain control of land to rule over. If we take that away, by design, ISIS cannot exist as an underground organization like Al Queda can. They must follow the strict rules set forth by their extremist interpretation of Islam. Take their land and you take away their legitimacy. Without that, they lose the strongest recruitment tool in their existence. Bombing them and training ill equipped forces in the region to hold them at bay will leave them with territory and give Baghdadi a main requirement of his position, allowing him to summon more fighters to join the cause.
Is is fairly straight forward to understand, but of course, a fucking mess to actually remedy in the real world. Understanding is key, the rest of the world must find the fortitude to put aside political squabbles to take care of this. There is a lot of mistrust and history to make almost all of the major players distrust each other. We can continue our petty wars and quest for economical dominance later. This needs to be handled now.