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I can’t even tell if you guys are saying you do or don’t agree with his move.
Ok, I pretense this as a long term TYT member:
Bernie shouldn't have bothered endorsing because it wasn't necessary, but it's totally aligned with the fact that TYT has continually supported his campaign and/or had him on the show with fair arguments and discussions. A large swath of Bernie's base are TYT members so - you are asking Sanders to ignore people who supported him and the Justice Democrats in the last cycle.
The wording pretty much implicates that Cenk decided that taking the endorsement just adds a blind spot in the eyes of Democrats who hate him and the show, and that it's not helping anyone to have this back and forth argument about an article written 20 years ago. On top of it, something he's been apologizing for for 15 years - and has hired a staff clearly stating the "misogyny" argument is slander not active assessment of political policy during most of the tenure of TYT at this point. The executive producer of the show, multiple directors, and producers, and hosts are women and now adding more differently minded women and people of color. So the argument lies really really empty if you have following things for longer than these dropped in articles we get about every 5 years.
Sanders "damage control" is just a way of not stoking unnecessary fires, because this will be out of the news cycle in two weeks.
What should be more relevant is that the reason these attacks started is because a DNC sanctioned candidate was chosen for the primary in a seat that could fall more left; and people are offended by him not accepting that it's an ordained seat to a more center Democrat.
I can’t even tell if you guys are saying you do or don’t agree with his move.
Ok, I pretense this as a long term TYT member:
Bernie shouldn't have bothered endorsing because it wasn't necessary, but it's totally aligned with the fact that TYT has continually supported his campaign and/or had him on the show with fair arguments and discussions. A large swath of Bernie's base are TYT members so - you are asking Sanders to ignore people who supported him and the Justice Democrats in the last cycle.
The wording pretty much implicates that Cenk decided that taking the endorsement just adds a blind spot in the eyes of Democrats who hate him and the show, and that it's not helping anyone to have this back and forth argument about an article written 20 years ago. On top of it, something he's been apologizing for for 15 years - and has hired a staff clearly stating the "misogyny" argument is slander not active assessment of political policy during most of the tenure of TYT at this point. The executive producer of the show, multiple directors, and producers, and hosts are women and now adding more differently minded women and people of color. So the argument lies really really empty if you have following things for longer than these dropped in articles we get about every 5 years.
Sanders "damage control" is just a way of not stoking unnecessary fires, because this will be out of the news cycle in two weeks.
What should be more relevant is that the reason these attacks started is because a DNC sanctioned candidate was chosen for the primary in a seat that could fall more left; and people are offended by him not accepting that it's an ordained seat to a more center Democrat.
This is a lot of text when you could just say Bernie made a dumb mistake. Either don’t endorse him in the first place or stick with your guns after you do.
Bernie shouldn't have bothered endorsing because it wasn't necessary, but it's totally aligned with the fact that TYT has continually supported his campaign and/or had him on the show with fair arguments and discussions. A large swath of Bernie's base are TYT members so - you are asking Sanders to ignore people who supported him and the Justice Democrats in the last cycle.
The wording pretty much implicates that Cenk decided that taking the endorsement just adds a blind spot in the eyes of Democrats who hate him and the show, and that it's not helping anyone to have this back and forth argument about an article written 20 years ago. On top of it, something he's been apologizing for for 15 years - and has hired a staff clearly stating the "misogyny" argument is slander not active assessment of political policy during most of the tenure of TYT at this point. The executive producer of the show, multiple directors, and producers, and hosts are women and now adding more differently minded women and people of color. So the argument lies really really empty if you have following things for longer than these dropped in articles we get about every 5 years.
Sanders "damage control" is just a way of not stoking unnecessary fires, because this will be out of the news cycle in two weeks.
What should be more relevant is that the reason these attacks started is because a DNC sanctioned candidate was chosen for the primary in a seat that could fall more left; and people are offended by him not accepting that it's an ordained seat to a more center Democrat.
This is a lot of text when you could just say Bernie made a dumb mistake. Either don’t endorse him in the first place or stick with your guns after you do.
You stated your confusion and someone explains the situation to you in a well thought out, intelligent manner, and you respond like this? Do you want an actual discussion or not? You get real mad when trolls here disregard the things you explain, don’t do it to others.
This endorsement raises grave concerns about Bernie's judgment. As president, would he allow Cenk Uygur to vote? Would he provide him with free health care? This is very troubling...
This is a lot of text when you could just say Bernie made a dumb mistake. Either don’t endorse him in the first place or stick with your guns after you do.
You stated your confusion and someone explains the situation to you in a well thought out, intelligent manner, and you respond like this? Do you want an actual discussion or not? You get real mad when trolls here disregard the things you explain, don’t do it to others.
First of all I want to note that youd never call out Emoney when he talks to me in the same way.
Second - I think Bandeto knows that I like and respect him. Im still directly calling out the fact that you guys aren’t willing to admit when Bernie makes a small mistake.
You stated your confusion and someone explains the situation to you in a well thought out, intelligent manner, and you respond like this? Do you want an actual discussion or not? You get real mad when trolls here disregard the things you explain, don’t do it to others.
First of all I want to note that youd never call out Emoney when he talks to me in the same way.
Second - I think Bandeto knows that I like and respect him. Im still directly calling out the fact that you guys aren’t willing to admit when Bernie makes a small mistake.
It's really important to note that my first sentence was Bernie shouldn't have bothered endorsing - and I set up the rest of the statement as a starting argument instead of acting defensive about TYT and my personal positioning. It was a mistake because it was unnecessary and counterproductive -- the rest of it is alliterating what occurred. We just don't see it as black and white -- also people above stated that it was a lukewarm response and he shouldn't have waffled on it.
You stated your confusion and someone explains the situation to you in a well thought out, intelligent manner, and you respond like this? Do you want an actual discussion or not? You get real mad when trolls here disregard the things you explain, don’t do it to others.
First of all I want to note that youd never call out Emoney when he talks to me in the same way.
Second - I think Bandeto knows that I like and respect him. Im still directly calling out the fact that you guys aren’t willing to admit when Bernie makes a small mistake.
First of all I want to note that youd never call out Emoney when he talks to me in the same way.
Second - I think Bandeto knows that I like and respect him. Im still directly calling out the fact that you guys aren’t willing to admit when Bernie makes a small mistake.
It's really important to note that my first sentence was Bernie shouldn't have bothered endorsing - and I set up the rest of the statement as a starting argument instead of acting defensive about TYT and my personal positioning. It was a mistake because it was unnecessary and counterproductive -- the rest of it is alliterating what occurred. We just don't see it as black and white -- also people above stated that it was a lukewarm response and he shouldn't have waffled on it.
I missed your emphasis in that first post I think. Apologies for that.
I personally think he should have endorsed Cenk and not folded under twitter mob pressure. But I certainly understand the thought that he should have never endorsed him at all.
Im still directly calling out the fact that you guys aren’t willing to admit when Bernie makes a small mistake.
lol so your whole "What do you guys think about this? Can someone explain what they feel about it?" question was literally just you fishing and wanting people to say he made a mistake. You wouldn't have accepted any other type of response. Lame. Do you want actual discussion or just want to criticize people for not saying exactly what you want to hear?
The answer to the question of "Did bernie mishandle his endorsement of the guy who founded the organization that got AOC elected and has done more for the progressive cause than most people you can think of, but did a sexism 20 years ago?" is a resounding "Who Gives a Shit?"
I guess we can play along and concern troll about whether it might change other people's theoretical votes, but it sounds more like one poster just wants to get people to say Bernie Did a Bad Thing, such a naughty Bernie!
Im still directly calling out the fact that you guys aren’t willing to admit when Bernie makes a small mistake.
lol so your whole "What do you guys think about this? Can someone explain what they feel about it?" question was literally just you fishing and wanting people to say he made a mistake. You wouldn't have accepted any other type of response. Lame. Do you want actual discussion or just want to criticize people for not saying exactly what you want to hear?
I knew what I thought. But I wanted to see how Bernie fans dealt with a clear mistake. And I was ready to talk to Pablo, SFA, Bandeto etc about their opinion
if this was about literally any other candidate, it would be totally acceptable on inforoo.
The answer to the question of "Did bernie mishandle his endorsement of the guy who founded the organization that got AOC elected and has done more for the progressive cause than most people you can think of, but did a sexism 20 years ago?" is a resounding "Who Gives a Shit?"
I guess we can play along and concern troll about whether it might change other people's theoretical votes, but it sounds more like one poster just wants to get people to say Bernie Did a Bad Thing, such a naughty Bernie!
Im interested to see how intellectually honest you are.
Even though I don’t think its a big deal. Because I actually don’t believe you are a troll.
The answer to the question of "Did bernie mishandle his endorsement of the guy who founded the organization that got AOC elected and has done more for the progressive cause than most people you can think of, but did a sexism 20 years ago?" is a resounding "Who Gives a Shit?"
I guess we can play along and concern troll about whether it might change other people's theoretical votes, but it sounds more like one poster just wants to get people to say Bernie Did a Bad Thing, such a naughty Bernie!
Im interested to see how intellectually honest you are.
Even though I don’t think its a big deal. Because I actually don’t believe you are a troll.
I could explain to you that Bernie is a compromise candidate, and while not perfect, he's by far the best choice we have, but you in particular are under a very specific delusion that this is not the case, so what's the point in me saying "Radical Islamic Terrorism" to satisfy you, especially given the incredible insignificance of this "error"? At least try to get me to criticize one of his actual policies instead of wasting my time with inane bullshit
If my reward for criticizing my favored candidate is "A broke-brained yang voter claims he will consider me intellectually honest", well, I'm afraid that's not very convincing
Concern trolling in the name of Intellectual Honesty. I guess this is what you have to resort to when "C'mon, you have to admit that my candidate is like 3rd best in a field of republicans, right?" doesn't pan out the way you had hoped
Im interested to see how intellectually honest you are.
Even though I don’t think its a big deal. Because I actually don’t believe you are a troll.
I could explain to you that Bernie is a compromise candidate, and while not perfect, he's by far the best choice we have, but you in particular are under a very specific delusion that this is not the case, so what's the point in me saying "Radical Islamic Terrorism" to satisfy you, especially given the incredible insignificance of this "error"? At least try to get me to criticize one of his actual policies instead of wasting my time with inane bullshit
If my reward for criticizing my favored candidate is "A broke-brained yang voter claims he will consider me intellectually honest", well, I'm afraid that's not very convincing
Im quite certain that you are aware that I plan to vote for bernie once yang drops out. It isn’t some landmark loss for you to just admit your guy made a mistake.
OK, neat, let us know when you're done pretending to care about insignificant bullshit in the politics thread in order to extract concessions from your posting enemies
OK, neat, let us know when you're done pretending to care about insignificant bullshit in the politics thread in order to extract concessions from your posting enemies
When you aren’t honest about the little things, it becomes more difficult to trust you on the big things.
OK, neat, let us know when you're done pretending to care about insignificant bullshit in the politics thread in order to extract concessions from your posting enemies
When you aren’t honest about the little things, it becomes more difficult to trust you on the big things.
Your entire stance on this Cenk thing. Hitting me with a bunch of “what aboutisms”. Or that the ends justify the means.
Quote me doing about a whataboutism
"The ends justify the means" is usually deployed in defense of people doing actual evil, not being awkward about an endorsement. That is an absurd accusation.
Or you can just say that you also agree with the idea of him endorsing Cenk then hearing the twitter mobs fumes and unendorsing him moments later.
I don't give a shit whether he endorses Cenk or not, or how he handles an endorsement of Cenk. It is not materially relevant to the issues that matter in the 2020 Democratic Presidential Primary, and I have been consistent on this point from the start
It is not "dishonest" to elect not to bend to your whims on this topic
Your entire stance on this Cenk thing. Hitting me with a bunch of “what aboutisms”. Or that the ends justify the means.
Quote me doing about a whataboutism
"The ends justify the means" is usually deployed in defense of people doing actual evil, not being awkward about an endorsement. That is an absurd accusation.
This whole thing would just be easier if you said, “Bernies move was lame, but it doesnt change my position on him being the best candidate by far.”
Or you could make an argument for why this was a good move... which I dont think you will do. But maybe you will. And thats why I asked the question in the first place.
Thank you for admitting that your accusation of my dishonesty was completely unfounded.
I'm sure this would in fact be easier for you if I kowtowed to your absurd and worthless demands. Sadly, I do not post in this thread to make things easy for you
Thank you for admitting that your accusation of my dishonesty was completely unfounded.
I'm sure this would in fact be easier for you if I kowtowed to your absurd and worthless demands. Sadly, I do not post in this thread to make things easy for you
I could quote any of your initial responses to my question about Cenk. You’ve still failed to answer the basic question of whether or not you agree with his moves.
So maybe not outright dishonest, but politiciany... by not directly responding to the question.
I'm not a huge fan of Cenk and don't feel strongly about Bernie's endorsement or lack thereof, but the things he wrote 20 years ago are pretty disgusting. "Sexist pig" would be a pretty apt descriptor, though I'll let others look it up themselves if they're interested. Personally, I tend to be of the belief that people can and do change, and Cenk probably both personally and professionally regrets saying some of the things we've said, but also probably has a decent amount of sexism still in him. As do most American men.
My question though, is would anyone feel differently when comparing this situation to others' past transgressions? What comes to mind is the governor (I think in Virginia) who wore blackface to a college party 35 years ago. Absolutely disgusting; also 35 years ago. Times change, people change, society's sentiment regarding various issues change - what deserves forgiveness and what doesn't? If you think Cenk statement's aren't a big deal: if Cenk was a Republican in 2020 and similarly disavowed and apologized for his previous statements (and his current platform substantiated that), should his statements be viewed equally unimportantly? If so, would you be willing to defend that position when in a room of other leftists, while simultaneously fighting against his overall platform? How does our team affiliation affect how we view the same actions of people on the other side?
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5.5/four tet, daphni b2b floating points, avalon emerson 5.12/neil young 5.19/mannequin pussy 5.21/serpentwithfeet 5.25/hozier 6.12-16/bonnaroo 6.28/goose 6.29/goose 9.17/the national + the war on drugs 9.23/sigur ros 9.27-29/making time 10.17/air