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I don't mean this to sound bad the way it's going to come out, but I'm genuinely curious. What is wrong with vape smoke that you'd get so upset with them to "get all mom" on them? I would totally understand if it were cigarette smoke. Like Jaz, I feel bad when I smoke a cigarette in a crowd. When I'm fucked up I gradually become less considerate, not initially I just become less aware of it, but I always at least try to keep the smoke away from people. I usually hold it backwards in my hand so the smoke just gets on me, then I exhale the smoke upwards. But I know it stil smells and I try to be very aware of those around me because of it. I was looking forward to not having to really worry about that with vaping this year. What is it about the "smoke" from the vape that you found bothersome?
Again, I'm genuinely curious but I can't figure out to word this where it doesn't sound kind bitchy. Def not trying to bitchy. Lol.
They turn it up super high to get tons of smoke out of it. I mean TONS! It totally engulfed me in smoke. He was just puff, puff, puff and not really smoking it. I attribute it to being young, stupid and never really vaping before. People were moving away from him it was so bad. Plus, whatever flavor he was smoking was horrible smelling. The thing that bothered me was the amount of vape he was putting out. My boyfriend vapes, it does NOT bother me. I let him to it in the house. Every once in awhile if he has a bad smell it will fuck with my asthma or will blow right in my face, but that is a rarity. I don't know if I can even describe how much vape this kid was putting out. Which is why I first turned around and just said, "Really?" I feel like he was doing it to be an asshole as well.
EDIT: Also, my guy said that vaping like that is such a waste because you burn out your coils and that is when you get those toxins that they are trying to attribute to daily vapers.
You didn't sound bitchy, btw.
Gotcha. I don't think I let out very much smoke when I do it. Or at least I don't think I do. But I def don't let out enough to be obnoxious. I do hit it constantly though. That's been the biggest drawback to the switch. I feel like I'm coooonstantly taking hits off it. But I did it at a show in somewhat close quarters before and it didn't really occur to me that it could be annoying or inconsiderate. But the difference there makes sense now. Thanks.
They turn it up super high to get tons of smoke out of it. I mean TONS! It totally engulfed me in smoke. He was just puff, puff, puff and not really smoking it. I attribute it to being young, stupid and never really vaping before. People were moving away from him it was so bad. Plus, whatever flavor he was smoking was horrible smelling. The thing that bothered me was the amount of vape he was putting out. My boyfriend vapes, it does NOT bother me. I let him to it in the house. Every once in awhile if he has a bad smell it will fuck with my asthma or will blow right in my face, but that is a rarity. I don't know if I can even describe how much vape this kid was putting out. Which is why I first turned around and just said, "Really?" I feel like he was doing it to be an asshole as well.
EDIT: Also, my guy said that vaping like that is such a waste because you burn out your coils and that is when you get those toxins that they are trying to attribute to daily vapers.
You didn't sound bitchy, btw.
Gotcha. I don't think I let out very much smoke when I do it. Or at least I don't think I do. But I def don't let out enough to be obnoxious. I do hit it constantly though. That's been the biggest drawback to the switch. I feel like I'm coooonstantly taking hits off it. But I did it at a show in somewhat close quarters before and it didn't really occur to me that it could be annoying or inconsiderate. But the difference there makes sense now. Thanks.
You probably don't. My guy is constantly upgrading parts and tweaking it to his personal liking, and vapes constantly. It rarely bothers me. When he lowers his nicotine he does get a higher vapor ratio and vapes a bit more until he gets used to the lower nicotine but it is never anything compared to what I encountered with that kid. I have never been anywhere else that it has ever bothered me. So I would say that you are fine.
Surprised by how many of you guys vape. I quit smoking right around when that was getting popular. Isn't the vaping worse for you, or is that a myth?
I've never picked up a cig in my life but I do love hookah and the occasional vape.
A year(ish) ago, all of my friends got on the "quit smoking by using vape" train. At first, it seemed to all help them. In terms of health, none of them still smoke cigarettes. In terms of money, most of them spend at least twice on vape mods/juices a month than they did on cigs themselves. I've also noticed my friends tend to vape every few minutes where cigarettes you didn't do it that often bc most people had to step outside to do it.
Shit.. when I go over to my buddy's house, he pulls out a small vape just for me and I puff on it the whole night while kicking it and I'm not a smoker (except the good stuff ;P ). It's fun though. I'm sure it's waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay better than cigs but it's still fucking expensive.
I cut my smoking bill in half by vaping! but I order all my stuff on line for about 1/3 of the price of vape shops. Just have to be smart about it. that being said, I do get WAY more nicotine than I did smoking cigs b/c I will sit there and non stop puff that bastard for hours sometimes.
They turn it up super high to get tons of smoke out of it. I mean TONS! It totally engulfed me in smoke. He was just puff, puff, puff and not really smoking it. I attribute it to being young, stupid and never really vaping before. People were moving away from him it was so bad. Plus, whatever flavor he was smoking was horrible smelling. The thing that bothered me was the amount of vape he was putting out. My boyfriend vapes, it does NOT bother me. I let him to it in the house. Every once in awhile if he has a bad smell it will fuck with my asthma or will blow right in my face, but that is a rarity. I don't know if I can even describe how much vape this kid was putting out. Which is why I first turned around and just said, "Really?" I feel like he was doing it to be an asshole as well.
EDIT: Also, my guy said that vaping like that is such a waste because you burn out your coils and that is when you get those toxins that they are trying to attribute to daily vapers.
You didn't sound bitchy, btw.
Gotcha. I don't think I let out very much smoke when I do it. Or at least I don't think I do. But I def don't let out enough to be obnoxious. I do hit it constantly though. That's been the biggest drawback to the switch. I feel like I'm coooonstantly taking hits off it. But I did it at a show in somewhat close quarters before and it didn't really occur to me that it could be annoying or inconsiderate. But the difference there makes sense now. Thanks.
Ya, the higher you have it turned up the more vapor that comes out. to be fair, many studies are so far showing there are no chemicals in that "smoke".
I've never picked up a cig in my life but I do love hookah and the occasional vape.
A year(ish) ago, all of my friends got on the "quit smoking by using vape" train. At first, it seemed to all help them. In terms of health, none of them still smoke cigarettes. In terms of money, most of them spend at least twice on vape mods/juices a month than they did on cigs themselves. I've also noticed my friends tend to vape every few minutes where cigarettes you didn't do it that often bc most people had to step outside to do it.
Shit.. when I go over to my buddy's house, he pulls out a small vape just for me and I puff on it the whole night while kicking it and I'm not a smoker (except the good stuff ;P ). It's fun though. I'm sure it's waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay better than cigs but it's still fucking expensive.
I cut my smoking bill in half by vaping! but I order all my stuff on line for about 1/3 of the price of vape shops. Just have to be smart about it. that being said, I do get WAY more nicotine than I did smoking cigs b/c I will sit there and non stop puff that bastard for hours sometimes.
Yeah Jeremy watches review videos on all the new battery packs and vape holder thingy (whatever all that shit is), and then orders it online along with his liquid. He's so into it, I just nod and smile.
It gets pretty damn tiring being the adult at bedtime. My fiance always seems to want to do a music jam right at 8:30 - when the kids are supposed to start getting ready for bed. I try to say "It's bedtime" nicely over the blaring music and loud drumset, and always get a blank stare from my guy or no acknowledgement at all. Then I walk away, come back in a few minutes and try it again. Then he always gets pissed at me like I'm nagging. The kids don't ever make a move to stop playing music until he stops, because if they stop before he's ready to, he gets upset and wants them to play more. It's exhausting being the bad guy
It gets pretty damn tiring being the adult at bedtime. My fiance always seems to want to do a music jam right at 8:30 - when the kids are supposed to start getting ready for bed. I try to say "It's bedtime" nicely over the blaring music and loud drumset, and always get a blank stare from my guy or no acknowledgement at all. Then I walk away, come back in a few minutes and try it again. Then he always gets pissed at me like I'm nagging. The kids don't ever make a move to stop playing music until he stops, because if they stop before he's ready to, he gets upset and wants them to play more. It's exhausting being the bad guy
Maybe you should have a talk and come up with a compromise so you aren't always being the bad guy. Like jam has to start by this time. It's a rough situation but y'all are partners and it's all about finding a happy place for both of y'all.
It gets pretty damn tiring being the adult at bedtime. My fiance always seems to want to do a music jam right at 8:30 - when the kids are supposed to start getting ready for bed. I try to say "It's bedtime" nicely over the blaring music and loud drumset, and always get a blank stare from my guy or no acknowledgement at all. Then I walk away, come back in a few minutes and try it again. Then he always gets pissed at me like I'm nagging. The kids don't ever make a move to stop playing music until he stops, because if they stop before he's ready to, he gets upset and wants them to play more. It's exhausting being the bad guy
Maybe you should have a talk and come up with a compromise so you aren't always being the bad guy. Like jam has to start by this time. It's a rough situation but y'all are partners and it's all about finding a happy place for both of y'all.
That's been tried before. It doesn't work. Hence my continued frustration :/
Maybe you should have a talk and come up with a compromise so you aren't always being the bad guy. Like jam has to start by this time. It's a rough situation but y'all are partners and it's all about finding a happy place for both of y'all.
That's been tried before. It doesn't work. Hence my continued frustration :/
I 100% feel you. Boys are the worst when it comes to that. With my ex, I was always the bad guy too (90% of the time). He was fun and whatever, I was mean and rule maker. Frustrating. I'm sorry, wish I had more advice.
Why is it that a group of people can't get together with something important to say anymore without burning shit down?
*cracks knuckles*
Where do I begin?
1. I don't agree with the whole rioting thing, but I understand why people are doing it.
2. A bunch of people are taking (for lack of a better term) advantage of the situation, and using the protests as a way to start trouble. Today's madness was started by high schoolers who just wanted to start shit, and escalated from there. There's also a strong likelihood that similar to Ferguson, there's a number of people out-of-area coming in for the sole purpose of rioting and starting shit with cops. It would not shock me if a significant number of those arrested are from New York, Chicago, DC, etc... And that's not even considering AP's (agent provocateurs) either, which I wouldn't be surprised if there were some of those also.
3. I know a guy who works for a news outlet based in Baltimore, and he's been down on the ground watching a lot of this. The main TV outlets are covering this whole situation very badly. Obviously one must take into advantage the natural media biases, but between this and Ferguson it's at absurd levels.
To quote a recent Dave Zirin article: "Most everything the media reported about the Baltimore protests has skirted the line between the highly sensationalistic and the libelous. Every headline and photo has focused on property damage, allegedly done by those protesting for Freddie Gray. Played down or ignored is the Baltimore I saw: a place where more than 2,000 people—including families and children—marched resolutely while helicopters and visible surveillance drones flew overhead."
You could also look at the issues of institutional racism, the hopelessness caused by extreme poverty and decades of economic crisis, the rampant corruption of Baltimore's police and government, the military industrial complex expanding into urban policing, failures of the capitalist system, etc...
And now I've retaken my throne as the Inforoo resident nutjob.
No offense to anyone here that I love, but I think it's insane and asinine that those living within the privileges given to them by history, find such strong contempt for the anger of the oppressed in this nation. Baltimore, is one of the most oppressive to live in cities in the Northeast, and has amazingly clear physical divide in class and race. One side of the city is the hood and Red Light District, and the other side is colleges -- the idea that the youth their are supposed to keep their oppression to themselves is wrong. IT'S FUCKING WRONG to believe your oppressors will give you your goddamn freedom. These police start crowding in full riot gear on the ONSET of any march, so like a bully on social media, when either a random person or the police decide to troll EVERYTHING blows up. The police in Baltimore (multiple reports of this) evacuated buses headed out of school and generally traveling the area (a lot of people use the bus there, really tho.) -- due to the protests. All this prior to anything burning. But what we do as a country is blame the fucking black people for not shutting the fuck up and accepting it.
No offense to anyone here that I love, but I think it's insane and asinine that those living within the privileges given to them by history, find such strong contempt for the anger of the oppressed in this nation. Baltimore, is one of the most oppressive to live in cities in the Northeast, and has amazingly clear physical divide in class and race. One side of the city is the hood and Red Light District, and the other side is colleges -- the idea that the youth their are supposed to keep their oppression to themselves is wrong. IT'S FUCKING WRONG to believe your oppressors will give you your goddamn freedom. These police start crowding in full riot gear on the ONSET of any march, so like a bully on social media, when either a random person or the police decide to troll EVERYTHING blows up. The police in Baltimore (multiple reports of this) evacuated buses headed out of school and generally traveling the area (a lot of people use the bus there, really tho.) -- due to the protests. All this prior to anything burning. But what we do as a country is blame the fucking black people for not shutting the fuck up and accepting it.
You are certainly right, I do have a lot of privileges based on the color of my skin. I have never had an interaction with a cop where I felt at fear of being harmed or treated unfairly. But I don't think that makes my opinion that burning down random businesses and shit is fucking stupid any less valid. And yes it absolutely comes from both sides. The police make the situation worse by acting as aggressors. That doesn't just happen with matters of race. I don't know what the solution is, but it sure seems to me violent protests aren't helping the situation and only hurt people on both sides and those in the cross fire.
I've seen videos where the BPD was throwing rocks and bricks at protesters.
I read a report where a man tried talking to a reporter about the above mentioned incident, only to be pushed away by the news crew - and then tackled by BPD and arrested for the effort.
I've seen reports of Orioles fans on Sunday harassing a peaceful march near Camden Yards, calling people the n-word (and white allies n-lovers) along with trying to provoke fights with protesters.
I've seen reports where innocent people are being arrested, just being grabbed off the street because they're near protests. (And this shit does happen far more often than you'd want it to.)
I've seen videos where the BPD was throwing rocks and bricks at protesters.
I read a report where a man tried talking to a reporter about the above mentioned incident, only to be pushed away by the news crew - and then tackled by BPD and arrested for the effort.
I've seen reports of Orioles fans on Sunday harassing a peaceful march near Camden Yards, calling people the n-word (and white allies n-lovers) along with trying to provoke fights with protesters.
I've seen reports where innocent people are being arrested, just being grabbed off the street because they're near protests. (And this shit does happen far more often than you'd want it to.)
I believe all of this. But a negative and a negative don't make a positive.
40 acres and a fucking mule. See you guys on the farm. taking a break from here to try to create something meaningful. I just can't fuckin do it anymore
I've seen videos where the BPD was throwing rocks and bricks at protesters.
I read a report where a man tried talking to a reporter about the above mentioned incident, only to be pushed away by the news crew - and then tackled by BPD and arrested for the effort.
I've seen reports of Orioles fans on Sunday harassing a peaceful march near Camden Yards, calling people the n-word (and white allies n-lovers) along with trying to provoke fights with protesters.
I've seen reports where innocent people are being arrested, just being grabbed off the street because they're near protests. (And this shit does happen far more often than you'd want it to.)
I believe all of this. But a negative and a negative don't make a positive.
My role here is more of an educational spot - to tell people more to the story than what's being portrayed in the mass media outlets. Whether or not you agree with the actions of characters within the story is up to you.
No offense to anyone here that I love, but I think it's insane and asinine that those living within the privileges given to them by history, find such strong contempt for the anger of the oppressed in this nation. Baltimore, is one of the most oppressive to live in cities in the Northeast, and has amazingly clear physical divide in class and race. One side of the city is the hood and Red Light District, and the other side is colleges -- the idea that the youth their are supposed to keep their oppression to themselves is wrong. IT'S FUCKING WRONG to believe your oppressors will give you your goddamn freedom. These police start crowding in full riot gear on the ONSET of any march, so like a bully on social media, when either a random person or the police decide to troll EVERYTHING blows up. The police in Baltimore (multiple reports of this) evacuated buses headed out of school and generally traveling the area (a lot of people use the bus there, really tho.) -- due to the protests. All this prior to anything burning. But what we do as a country is blame the fucking black people for not shutting the fuck up and accepting it.
You are certainly right, I do have a lot of privileges based on the color of my skin. I have never had an interaction with a cop where I felt at fear of being harmed or treated unfairly. But I don't think that makes my opinion that burning down random businesses and shit is fucking stupid any less valid. And yes it absolutely comes from both sides. The police make the situation worse by acting as aggressors. That doesn't just happen with matters of race. I don't know what the solution is, but it sure seems to me violent protests aren't helping the situation and only hurt people on both sides and those in the cross fire.
As usual, I come across someone that makes my point better than I could. Nonviolence as Compliance The burning and looting and related actions are not necessarily the wisest or more just actions, but they might be a natural progression of the situation these people have been put in.
You are certainly right, I do have a lot of privileges based on the color of my skin. I have never had an interaction with a cop where I felt at fear of being harmed or treated unfairly. But I don't think that makes my opinion that burning down random businesses and shit is fucking stupid any less valid. And yes it absolutely comes from both sides. The police make the situation worse by acting as aggressors. That doesn't just happen with matters of race. I don't know what the solution is, but it sure seems to me violent protests aren't helping the situation and only hurt people on both sides and those in the cross fire.
As usual, I come across someone that makes my point better than I could. Nonviolence as Compliance The burning and looting and related actions are not necessarily the wisest or more just actions, but they might be a natural progression of the situation these people have been put in.
Read that piece on the bus this morning. I read The Atlantic regularly and really appreciate Coates' perspective on racial issues. Considering that many Americans are convinced that racism is non-existent these days, I think he does a great service to the cause of eliminating racial discrimination. He consistently puts racial issues front-and-center, but he's eloquent and nowhere near as divisive as someone like Al Sharpton. As a white male who grew up in a predominantly white middle-class suburb and never experienced such injustices, I find his pieces very informative and educational.
"When nonviolence begins halfway through the war with the aggressor calling time out, it exposes itself as a ruse."
That was probably the best article I think I've read on the subject. That quote alone says a lot.
I don't condone acts of violence and destruction associated with protests because I think it undermines the message behind the protests. That being said, it's also a bit hypocritical to expect people who have had acts of violence and brutality committed against them to remain peaceful and non-violent themselves. I just hope the repeated coverage of these issues will actually lead to sweeping reforms in police departments and local governments across the country.
"When nonviolence begins halfway through the war with the aggressor calling time out, it exposes itself as a ruse."
That was probably the best article I think I've read on the subject. That quote alone says a lot.
I don't condone acts of violence and destruction associated with protests because I think it undermines the message behind the protests. That being said, it's also a bit hypocritical to expect people who have had acts of violence and brutality committed against them to remain peaceful and non-violent themselves.
This. I'm a pretty resolute pacifist but also realize that in the world in which we are currently living, through and through pacifism is sadly not an obtainable reality. Which I hate. But how can I look at someone who has been discriminated against and physically abused by way of that discrimination, by little or no fault of their own, and think "no, now you just have to show them the power of peace making" - especially when historically that, for the most part, hasn't worked for SHIT.
Considering you've found the need to respond to my threads as if you are threatened by me I offer you some peace my confused counterpart. May you find peace in your restless soul.
You are certainly right, I do have a lot of privileges based on the color of my skin. I have never had an interaction with a cop where I felt at fear of being harmed or treated unfairly. But I don't think that makes my opinion that burning down random businesses and shit is fucking stupid any less valid. And yes it absolutely comes from both sides. The police make the situation worse by acting as aggressors. That doesn't just happen with matters of race. I don't know what the solution is, but it sure seems to me violent protests aren't helping the situation and only hurt people on both sides and those in the cross fire.
As usual, I come across someone that makes my point better than I could. Nonviolence as Compliance The burning and looting and related actions are not necessarily the wisest or more just actions, but they might be a natural progression of the situation these people have been put in.
Maybe I am naive. I think calling violence a natural progression is an excuse. If you hold you self to the lowest denominator of those you oppose there is no where to go but down. I think this is particularly important with matters of civil rights in this country where so many of the great leaders preached and the great victories were accomplished through nonviolence. Yes, often one sided nonviolence.
There are many people who very honestly raise the question of self-defense. This must be placed in perspective. It goes without saying that people will protect their homes. This is a right guaranteed by the Constitution and respected even in the worst areas of the South. But the mere protection of one’s home and person against assault by lawless night riders does not provide any positive approach to the fears and conditions which produce violence. There must be some program for establishing law. Our experience in places like Savannah and Macon, Georgia, has been that a drive which registers Negroes to vote can do more to provide protection of the law and respect for Negroes by even racist sheriffs than anything we have seen.
In a nonviolent demonstration, self-defense must be approached from quite another perspective. One must remember that the cause of the demonstration is some exploitation or form of oppression that has made it necessary for men of courage and good will to demonstrate against evil. For example, a demonstration against the evil of de facto school segregation is based on the awareness that a child’s mind is crippled daily by inadequate educational opportunity. The demonstrator agrees that is better for him to suffer publicly for a short time to end the crippling evil of school segregation than to have generation after generation of children suffer in ignorance.
In such a demonstration, the point is made that schools are inadequate. This is the evil to which one seeks to point; anything else detracts from that point and interferes with confrontation of the primary evil against which one demonstrates. Of course, no one wants to suffer and be hurt. But it is more important to get at the cause than to be safe. It is better to shed a little blood from a blow on the head or a rock thrown by an angry mob than to have children by the thousands grow up reading at a fifth- or sixth-grade reading level.
It is always amusing to me when a Negro man says that he can’t demonstrate with us because if someone hit him he would fight back. Here is a man whose children are being plagued by rats and roaches, whose wife is robbed daily at overpriced ghetto food stores, who himself is working for about two-thirds the pay of a white person doing a similar job and with similar skills, and in spite of all this daily suffering it takes someone spitting on him and calling him a nigger to make him want to fight.
Conditions are such for Negroes in America that all Negroes ought to be fighting aggressively. It is as ridiculous for a Negro to raise the question of self-defense in relation to nonviolence as it is for a soldier on the battlefield to say his is not going to take any risks. He is there because he believes that the freedom of his country is worth the risk of his life. The same is true of the nonviolent demonstrator. He sees the misery of his people so clearly that he volunteers to suffer in their behalf and put an end to their plight.
Furthermore, it is extremely dangerous to organize a movement around self-defense. The line between defensive violence and aggressive or retaliatory violence is a fine line indeed. When violence is tolerated even as a means of self-defense there is a grave danger that in the fervor of emotion the main fight will be lost over the question of self-defense.
When my home was bombed in 1955 in Montgomery, many men wanted to retaliate, to place an armed guard on my home. But the issue there was not my life, but whether Negroes would achieve first-class treatment on the city’s buses. Had we become distracted by the question of my safety we would have lost the moral offensive and sunk to the level of our oppressors.
I must continue by faith or it is too great a burden to bear and violence, even in self-defense, creates more problems than it solves. Only a refusal to hate or kill can put an end to the chain of violence in the world and lead us toward a community where men can live together without fear. Our goal is to create a beloved community and this will require a qualitative change in our souls as well as a quantitative change in our lives.
As usual, I come across someone that makes my point better than I could. Nonviolence as Compliance The burning and looting and related actions are not necessarily the wisest or more just actions, but they might be a natural progression of the situation these people have been put in.
Maybe I am naive. I think calling violence a natural progression is an excuse. If you hold you self to the lowest denominator of those you oppose there is no where to go but down. I think this is particularly important with matters of civil rights in this country where so many of the great leaders preached and the great victories were accomplished through nonviolence. Yes, often one sided nonviolence.
There would be no discussion if there hadn't been riots. Thousands marched peacefully prior to the riots beginning and there was no coverage of that. When this is your only way to be heard, you're going to do it. Do some people take advantage of the situation to act like a shit head? Probably. Is that everyone's motive? Definitely not. People are angry and tempers are rising and you can only watch violence going on in your community for so long before you pop. People have rioted for far less and much more trivial things than this. I find it sad that this is the only way this stuff gets coverage. That things have to be sensationalized and then exaggerated and/or falsely reported for ratings, then they'll report on it... This is coming from someone who had no idea what was going on until about 11:30pm EST last night. I hadn't heard of the situation at all prior to then. I know what happened now because of the riots. It may not be the best way to get heard, but it's effective and I understand it.
"It is not enough for me to stand before you tonight and condemn riots. It would be morally irresponsible for me to do that without, at the same time, condemning the contingent, intolerable conditions that exist in our society. These conditions are the things that cause individuals to feel that they have no other alternative than to engage in violent rebellions to get attention. And I must say tonight that a riot is the language of the unheard." -MLK JR.
Race is an incredibly complex issue, and there is no direct or simple solution, and there isn't always a right or wrong way to handle things. Sometimes the ends justify the means. Sometimes they don't. Regardless, I don't think selecting MLK quotes to support a stance is a great way to go about discussion - he was a complex man and it's easy to find things that will supports one's views. It is also important to remember that during the Civil Rights Movement, the injustices were embedded in the law, so it was much easier to have a peaceful protest that could point at something and say "Here, this is the problem". When the issue here is widespread racism in the minds of police officers, your target is invisible and moving. Since the current structure does not overtly indicate such racism in a direct and tangible way (such as in a written law), it is easier for those with power to say "Yes, you're being heard" in response to a peaceful protest and then not change a damn thing.
To be honest this (meaning the justification for rioting) is an issue that I don't have a strong opinion on because it is so complex, to the point where I don't believe myself or anyone that I encounter in my day-to-day life is educated enough on the subject to have a truly informed opinion on it.
Though I will make note that in a situation where the targeting of Black people is being protested against, if you watch the situation unfold and your biggest takeaway is a further criticism of Black people, then you are absolutely part of the system that is being protested against. If your stance is "Yes, I understand that there are racist cops doing bad things and they need to dealt with, but look what all these Black people are doing!" then I become wary that you are (consciously or not) choosing to focus on evidence that support your views and their place in the current imbalance of power. Yes, I personally believe that the rioting and violence is an issue, and it needs to be dealt with. But I trust that the Black community can and will deal with that. As a White person without a ethnic history of oppression or daily experience of such, I don't feel that it's in my place to speak on how someone else should react to something that I myself have never experienced. So while the the rioting is an issue, to choose to focus on that instead of the larger system that gave rise to it is to miss the forest for the trees.
This is about an imbalance of power. This is what I - and other White people with even a passing interest in equality - should be taking greater issue with, not on how oppressed people react to being oppressed.
Last Edit: Apr 28, 2015 13:29:58 GMT -5 by Jaz - Back to Top
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Though I will make note that in a situation where the targeting of Black people is being protested against, if you watch the situation unfold and your biggest takeaway is a further criticism of Black people, then you are absolutely part of the system that is being protested against. If your stance is "Yes, I understand that there are racist cops doing bad things and they need to dealt with, but look what all these Black people are doing!" then I become wary that you are (consciously or not) choosing to focus on evidence that support your views and their place in the current imbalance of power. Yes, I personally believe that the rioting and violence is an issue, and it needs to be dealt with. But I trust that the Black community can and will deal with that. As a White person without a ethnic history of oppression or daily experience of such, I don't feel that it's in my place to speak on how someone else should react to something that I myself have never experienced. So while the the rioting is an issue, to choose to focus on that instead of the larger system that gave rise to it is to miss the forest for the trees.
I have more faith in people to come together and demand change in a peaceful manner than I do in the system to get it right on their own. I think that is why I get a higher level of cognitive dissonance to the protests than the police brutality.
Though I will make note that in a situation where the targeting of Black people is being protested against, if you watch the situation unfold and your biggest takeaway is a further criticism of Black people, then you are absolutely part of the system that is being protested against. If your stance is "Yes, I understand that there are racist cops doing bad things and they need to dealt with, but look what all these Black people are doing!" then I become wary that you are (consciously or not) choosing to focus on evidence that support your views and their place in the current imbalance of power. Yes, I personally believe that the rioting and violence is an issue, and it needs to be dealt with. But I trust that the Black community can and will deal with that. As a White person without a ethnic history of oppression or daily experience of such, I don't feel that it's in my place to speak on how someone else should react to something that I myself have never experienced. So while the the rioting is an issue, to choose to focus on that instead of the larger system that gave rise to it is to miss the forest for the trees.
I have more faith in people to come together and demand change in a peaceful manner than I do in the system to get it right on their own. I think that is why I get a higher level of cognitive dissonance to the protests than the police brutality.
Can you explain or reword your second sentence? It's reading to me as "police brutality is easier for me to accept because I expect it" but I'm not sure if that's what you mean.
5.5/four tet, daphni b2b floating points, avalon emerson 5.12/neil young 5.19/mannequin pussy 5.21/serpentwithfeet 5.25/hozier 6.12-16/bonnaroo 6.28/goose 6.29/goose 9.17/the national + the war on drugs 9.23/sigur ros 9.27-29/making time 10.17/air