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Post by questionablesanity on Jun 30, 2009 10:55:38 GMT -5
All of this talk of death on the news and various threads on Inforoo makes me wonder what everyone here believes. This will either incite riots or bring up lots of good conversation. I hope for the latter.
Personally, I was raised Catholic, was baptised and confirmed. Since then, I have only stepped into a church (reluctantly) for funerals or weddings.
I cannot fathom the idea of living my life by a book that has been written and edited by man in the word of God. I don't consider myself an Atheist, but definitely an Agnostic.
Tell me what you think. Do you believe in the bible or think it's a crock of shit? Do you live your life by it or do you live by the morals outlined in said book? Do you attend church regularly or prefer prayer at home? Do you believe in heaven and hell? Do you think that if you don't believe that you will go to hell?
Just give me your point of view. I'm really interested because I recently read that the number of people who consider themselves agnostic or atheist is constantly rising. I believe it was about 18% of the population now. Which is higher than most religions outside of catholocism.
A Thieve's Parade 2/24 Conspirator 2/26 Kevin Smith 3/11 Keller 3/17 Papadosio 3/18 JJ Grey 3/25 Bela Fleck/Edgar Meyer 3/26 Toubab Krewe 3/27 O'Death 4/11 Budos Band 4/22 EOTO 4/28 Summer Camp 5/6-29 All Good
It sounds like we were cut from the same cloth and I have the same views as you it seems. I can not legitimately believe what was written in a book a bunch of years back without science. It must be the catholic school in me but I can not stop thinking that there is a G-d, kinda akin to the force that the Jedi talk about in Star Wars
BTW, this will probably get ugly...these are my beliefs and I'm not trying to convert anybody.
I'm the opposite of moderate, immaculately polished With the spirit of a hustler and the swagger of a college kid Allergic to the counterfeit, impartial to the politics Articulate but still would grab a ni**a by the colla quick
I am pretty spiritual, like you I was raised catholic. These days I do not really count myself as religious though. There is always the church of the sub-genius, it seems a bit attractive,as does pastafarianism.
Church mythology, or SubGenius Mythos, includes entities such as:
* Jehovah 1 (aka JHVH-1 or Jehovah-One), a God-like wrathful entity (a "wrathful alien space god from some corporate sin galaxy"). * NHGH (aka Nhee Ghee or Eehg Eehn), a Satan-like smiling entity (god of Bad Luck and Unfortunate Coincidences, cosmic embodiment of Murphy's Law) designed by Joe Riley.
All Hail Bob
Last Edit: Jun 30, 2009 11:10:18 GMT -5 by Deleted - Back to Top
I was raised Catholic/Lutheran - ultimately chose the Lutheran faith and that is where I stand.
That said - there are two factions (there are a few more - but the two main ones that I know) of being Lutheran:
Missouri Synod - which believes in a literal translation of the bible Evangelical Lutheran - which takes a more relaxed approach to it
I was baptized/confirmed and first took communion in the Missouri Synod church but have been ELCA for the past 20 years or so.
At this point - I do not attend church after a horrible experience with the church where I have been married twice and all 3 of my children have been baptized.
I don't believe that you must attend a formal worship service to believe in a higher being. Do I think there is a God? I think there is something - whether to call it one God or a conglomeration of all beliefs, I don't know.
I think that each person in the world should be free to believe or not believe in what they want.
I don't believe in a literal translation of the bible. i think that - like any other story that is handed down through the years - the actual meaning of it has - more than likely - changed many many times over the years.
I do try to live by the general morals presented but I don't necessarily believe in a heaven and a hell. Mainly because the one belief that I do have (from a literal translation) is that God gave his son for the forgiveness of all sin - therefore - as long as I am willing to confess my sin and ask forgiveness - then I am and will be forgiven.
Kinda like righting a wrong in my eyes - if you screw up - apologize - ask forgiveness - try to do better next time.
Live the best life you can by being good and kind to your fellow man. It doesn't always work - all you can do is try.
Post by NothingButFlowers on Jun 30, 2009 11:43:37 GMT -5
I grew up going to church a lot. Because my mom didn't go, I usually went with neighbors, and, in the summer, I went with my dad. But I think I always went to church more for the community spirit of it, and I got pretty disgusted with it when I got older and realized how much politicking, backstabbing, and gossiping goes on in many churches. Not all churches and not all churchgoers are like that, but a surprising amount of the ones I've encountered are.
I don't really consider myself a spiritual person. I don't believe in "God" or even a god anymore, but I also don't presume to know what is and is not out there. Actually, a large part of me really wishes that I could believe in God again because I'm pretty much terrified of dying, but I don't believe that fear of the unknown is a valid reason for believing in something that I don't really believe in.
The closest thing that I've experienced to spirituality in the last 10 years or so is being in total awe of nature, particularly the ocean. I love the water, and when I'm around water, it's one of the few times that I feel really peaceful.
Jess, I keep meaning to join the Church of the SubGenius! David Byrne is a member, and they have a ton of really cool holidays!
I don't beleive in God and I'm not very spiritual either. I grew up Lutheran and went to church every week up until I was older enough to make my own decisions. I know the bible. I just don't see how any of it is possible. So many of my friends tell me things like if it's to be then God will take care of it. Or, you just have to put yourself in God's hands. No, the only person I should depend on with my life is myself. There are so many things I can get into, but it is a touchy subject and I'm afraid it will all come out wrong.
I was raised Christian, was baptised at 18 after a bad trip but after reading the bible I started to feel that I could never live up to the standards the bible set. I lost faith and teetered between being a Christian in rebelion and an agnostic. Long story short I ended up a spiritually starved, broken man at 32 years.
I recently re-dedicated my life to Christ and and totally and unconditionally surrendered to his will. I've come to know him not as an overbearing master but a good and faithful sheppard.
matthew 11: 28-30 Come unto me, all ye that labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. (29) Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls. (30) For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.
I do believe in a place called Hell but I dont think it'll be much like the place some preachers warn us of in church: being constantly subjected to physical pain via fire and sulfur. I think it will simply be eternal seperation from God and I think the locks on the door will be activated from the inside, A final willful abandoning of the relationship that every human was designed and created to enjoy. I think the burning will be due to a sense of loss and the damned will be in an eternal state of contempt and sadness.
C.S. Lewis is an apologitic Christian author meaning his works are aimed at outsiders/non believers. I fully recomend the book Mere Christianity to anyone that is a sceptic but feels like maybe examining the issue a little closer and developing a strong stance in either direction would be in their best interest. think about Pascal's wager and give it a chance before you dismiss it.
anyone who wants a copy of mere christianity can pm me and I'll try to have it sent to you.
Post by generalstore on Jun 30, 2009 12:47:33 GMT -5
Not only am I a non believer, I actively despise all Abrahamic religions due to the enormous harm they've caused over the Millennia.
If I could go back in history and assassinate one person before they made their mark on history, it wouldn't be Hitler or Osama, it would be Paul of Tarsus (St Paul for you xtians). Without him Christianity would not have gained the momentum that it did and most likely would've died off, thus no Christianity. Islam wouldn't have happened either.
Think of how far we as a species would be today without Christianity prolonging the Dark Ages (they would've happened anyway after the fall of the Roman empire, but civilization would've rebounded much faster).
With all that said, I'm a live and let live type of guy, and above all else a humanist, so whatever you believe in is fine with me as long as you don't try to press your ideals and values upon others (cough cough Texas School Board). I never debate anyone about religious or spiritual topics b/c it is certainly one of those topics where you are not going to change a person's beliefs in any form of debate. But I do enjoy reading and listening to others on what they believe and why they do.
Raised Catholic, largely fallen now. I feel closest to God/spiritually fulfilled when surrounded by nature. Luckily, I find myself living in the forest; hiking trails to magnificent overlooks, paddling seemingly unspoiled rivers, picking gourmet edible wild mushrooms from the forest... On his retirement as chief UN weapons inspector, Hans Blix said, "I look forward to going hunting for wild mushrooms."
God is all around. Here are pictures of what I'm talking about:
This is the North Fork of the Shenandoah River. 15 mins. from my house.
This is the George Washington National Forest, where I live. My home is through the mountain gap and to the right, behind and below the ridge on the right-hand side; a 10min. drive and 1/2hr. hike from this spot. The Blue Ridge Mountains can be seen at the horizon.
These are Black Trumpet and Aromatic Milky Cap wild mushrooms picked from my front yard, 15 secs. from my front door.
Not only am I a non believer, I actively despise all Abrahamic religions due to the enormous harm they've caused over the Millennia.
If I could go back in history and assassinate one person before they made their mark on history, it wouldn't be Hitler or Osama, it would be Paul of Tarsus (St Paul for you xtians). Without him Christianity would not have gained the momentum that it did and most likely would've died off, thus no Christianity. Islam wouldn't have happened either.
Think of how far we as a species would be today without Christianity prolonging the Dark Ages (they would've happened anyway after the fall of the Roman empire, but civilization would've rebounded much faster).
With all that said, I'm a live and let live type of guy, and above all else a humanist, so whatever you believe in is fine with me as long as you don't try to press your ideals and values upon others (cough cough Texas School Board). I never debate anyone about religious or spiritual topics b/c it is certainly one of those topics where you are not going to change a person's beliefs in any form of debate. But I do enjoy reading and listening to others on what they believe and why they do.
For the record, it wasn't Paul that institutionalized Christianity. It was Emperor Constantine. But the British historians who popularized blaming Christianity for everything (which by the way is a tradition that has its roots in King Henry VIII's need to justify his own infidelity) have a love affair with Roman culture and tend to overlook the many ways that civilization got screwed up by the Romans and their need for empirical expansion.
And btw, Paul WAS assassinated. It didn't work. That's how it works with religion and/or Star Wars. When you kill someone, it just makes their message that much stronger.
For the record, it wasn't Paul that institutionalized Christianity. It was Emperor Constantine. But the British historians who popularized blaming Christianity for everything (which by the way is a tradition that has its roots in King Henry VIII's need to justify his own infidelity) have a love affair with Roman culture and tend to overlook the many ways that civilization got screwed up by the Romans and their need for empirical expansion.
And btw, Paul WAS assassinated. It didn't work. That's how it works with religion and/or Star Wars. When you kill someone, it just makes their message that much stronger.
lol at star wars, but he was the biggest missionary and the one person most historians attribute to the early spread of christianity, he was assassinated but not until his damage was already done.
Post by insidejoke on Jun 30, 2009 14:54:26 GMT -5
I'm a former member of the United Methodist Church. I attended 1-2 services a week until the age of 16. It was a wonderful, welcoming experience for me and helped mold my character for the better. In high school and college I participated sporadically, at best. In my mid-twenties I officially rescinded my membership because I didn't feel comfortable with where the church was going and how I spiritually fit in.
I am absolutely a believer in a higher power. I prescribe to the theory that all/most major religions of the world "talk" to the same entity. Humans have created organized religion in order to explain things they don't understand. I think it’s ridiculous to expect someone living in the deserts of Africa to believe the same doctrines as a suburbanite in Indiana. However, if we all followed the basic principles of many of the world religions (charity, honesty, humbleness, service to others, etc.) without fighting over which faith was *right*, the world would be a far better place.
Like Meg, I don't believe in a literal translation of the Bible. Those stories were again written by men to illustrate how Christians were supposed to behave. Kind of like a religious Aesop’s Fables. It is a valuable teaching tool; one that would serve each of us well if we took the time to read some or all of it. However, I’m uncomfortable with politicians taking scripture and translating into law. I’m a believer in a separation of church and state but also of freedom of religion.
I no longer attend regular church service. I’ve tried in vain the last few years to find a place where my children and I feel “at home.” I know in my heart there is one out there…I just haven’t found it yet. I practice daily prayer/meditation and share this with my little ones. It gives me solace, strength, and clarity to take a few moments daily to thank God/Allah/Buddha for the day I’ve had and to sort out any troubles I may have gathered along the way. I also teach my children the Golden Rule and other transferable religious beliefs that can make you a more pleasant and well-rounded person.
All in all, if folks don’t try and push their beliefs on me, I’ll return the favor. Spirituality can be divine and healing but not if it’s forced on you.
PS: riburroo, I'm envious of your surroundings. They are truly spectacular.
now that roo is over with for the year and all the post roo chatter has died down to not much more than what's going on in the arcade tent (most recent 50 posts are 80% arcade tent stuff) might as well...
eh - I have no problems rehashing stuff like this anyway - for me it is always nice to read other peoples points of view on a subject like this. As long as we can all play nice and post opinions without attacking others for what they believe
eh - I have no problems rehashing stuff like this anyway - for me it is always nice to read other peoples points of view on a subject like this. As long as we can all play nice and post opinions without attacking others for what they believe
SAY WHAAAAAT? whats a forum board without senseless mindless attacking of each other?
eh - I have no problems rehashing stuff like this anyway - for me it is always nice to read other peoples points of view on a subject like this. As long as we can all play nice and post opinions without attacking others for what they believe
SAY WHAAAAAT? whats a forum board without senseless mindless attacking of each other?
LMAO! Well - you have to admit - most of the time - we are a different kind of message board
Garth Algar: Do you ever get the feeling Benjamin's just using us?
Wayne Campbell: Good call. It's like he wants us to be liked by everyone. I mean Led Zeppelin didn't write tunes everybody liked. They left that to the Bee Gees.
PS: riburroo, I'm envious of your surroundings. They are truly spectacular.
I get more religion just stepping out my front door than I ever got from church. Love of nature I got from Dad. Mom raised me Catholic, which did instill some values, I have to admit.
Literally, the National Forest where I live has a total of almost a million acres. Paradise on earth.
Post by wonderllama on Jun 30, 2009 20:13:50 GMT -5
I seem to be right along the lines of Meg and insidejoke. I was raised Assemblies of God and went for the most part 3 times a week (Sunday 2x + Wednesday night) from the time I was born until I went off to college. And no, all Assemblies of God churches aren't like those nutbags that held the guns in church rally in Louisville, or the one Sarah Palin attends, but there's defenatley some things that are kinda out there that are paracticed commonly. Through education and life experiences, I've come to see things quite differently. I would still consider myself a Christian, in that I try to follow the moral teachings of Christ and believe that He is a path to rewards (whatever they may be) when we leave this mortal coil.
I see the Bible as part history book, part old Jewish law, and part religious allegory. It was written by men who in many instances lacked the knowledge or understanding to fully explain events around them, and edited by men often times with their own personal agendas in mind. There's a lot of good to be found in there, but it must be read with a discerning mind, which the vast majority of people don't do. I believe in God, which is the driving force in everything, and that he/she/it will show to those who truly seek, regardless of religious claim. I do think God reveals himself in very different ways to different people. Those common threads in all the major religions and belief systems I think comes from this.
I believe 100% in constantly questioning and evaluating one's belief system. That every teaching should be filtered through what we know as fact (science, historical events), and what we know furthers the greater good (love, honesty, helping others). I actually wish I could get my Christian friends and family to sit down and watch "Religilous", as Bill Maher does a great job of pointing out how completely fucked up Christanity and organized religion has become in our times.
I very rarely go to church now, but will probably start back up again when I have a kid to help give them a good moral base. But I will definately teach my child the difference between stories with a moral teaching and literal fact. I don't try to push my beliefs on others, but I'll glady share when the topic comes up. A person should come to God on their own free will and in their own manner, not have it forced upon them.
Post by awolfatthedoor on Jun 30, 2009 20:16:36 GMT -5
Normally I wouldn't want to discuss this on teh internetz because I would get flamed but you people are nice enough and mature enough to be able to have a discussion on religion. +1 to everyone if I could
I wouldn't say I'm religious at least in what I think of when people say a religious person. But I think of memorizing things that are outside of the Bible and accepting them as equal to God's words just in order to go to heaven. Which is what I have been told it takes before. Anyway to me I was raised in a Baptist church and I went to Lutheran school for 6th and 7th grade, which is when they go through confirmation. I've gone to the same church for 11 years and have been extremely disappointed in what it has turned into. But I still go to church pretty much every Sunday when I'm at home for the summer. At college I go to the BSU once or twice a week and go to church every Sunday where I'm not exhausted. I fully believe that the Bible is 100% truth, but I don't take everything literal because to me it is painfully obvious that some things are not meant to be taken literally in the Bible. I do believe in a heaven and a hell, and I do believe that Jesus was the Messiah and that entrance to heaven is based on whether each person has a personal relationship.
Those are my basic beliefs and my basic background. If anyone actually wants me to expand on my past or what I believe I will be happy too.
I usually stay out of the religious threads for obvious reasons. But here goes.
I was raised a STRICT southern baptist. I have since become a pantheistic Druid. The road was long and bumpy.
For me it is not my religion, but my way of life. It is free of the dogma and rigid beliefs that plagued my youth. I believe that Nature is both divine and sacred and "God" is present in everything. And like many of my pagan brethren, I believe in successive reincarnation.
I am a member The Order of Bards, Ovates, and Druids. Bards are the storytellers and musicians Ovates are the healers Druids are the teachers and judges I do a little of all three, and not necessarily well.