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I love Subban. He's an amazing player. But ya'll have him overrated. Plenty of flashy exciting players out there. Need more than skill to win. Last year price was out, the year before he took the Habs to the conference final (then got hurt and Habs lost. its apples and oranges in terms of what each player brings to the table. Habs got what get needed, and preds lost a captain in return of an exciting tallent that will help put people in the stands. Preds were already a contender, they just replaced leadership for skill and flash.
It's going to be very interesting to see how this all turns out.
I love Subban. He's an amazing player. But ya'll have him overrated. Plenty of flashy exciting players out there. Need more than skill to win. Last year price was out, the year before he took the Habs to the conference final (then got hurt and Habs lost. its apples and oranges in terms of what each player brings to the table. Habs got what get needed, and preds lost a captain in return of an exciting tallent that will help put people in the stands. Preds were already a contender, they just replaced leadership for skill and flash.
It's going to be very interesting to see how this all turns out.
There certainly is no denying that Subban didn't really fit in the Montreal locker room but his skill is undeniable. They could have got such a better return for him. It would be one thing if Weber was 3 years younger and they made this trade, but he already is declining and that contract is absolutely terrible. His shot suppression numbers were terrible last year, with him back there Price is going to be facing even more shots. Take a look at this chart
I love Subban. He's an amazing player. But ya'll have him overrated. Plenty of flashy exciting players out there. Need more than skill to win. Last year price was out, the year before he took the Habs to the conference final (then got hurt and Habs lost. its apples and oranges in terms of what each player brings to the table. Habs got what get needed, and preds lost a captain in return of an exciting tallent that will help put people in the stands. Preds were already a contender, they just replaced leadership for skill and flash.
It's going to be very interesting to see how this all turns out.
There certainly is no denying that Subban didn't really fit in the Montreal locker room but his skill is undeniable. They could have got such a better return for him. It would be one thing if Weber was 3 years younger and they made this trade, but he already is declining and that contract is absolutely terrible. His shot suppression numbers were terrible last year, with him back there Price is going to be facing even more shots. Take a look at this chart
all these charts are skewed towards favouring offensive statistics. There are no real statistics for the things Webber does, besides hits. You say price will see more shots based off offensive stats. Where in that chart are the blocked shots and takeaways? Where's the "clearing bodies from the front of the net" stats, where's the "I dare you to come into this corner and get the puck" stats.
I get it. People love offense. People love the advanced stats. But they do not tell the story of what happens on the ice. My one real concern about Weber is his foot speed. If they put Weber with Markov, I'll be concerned. Weber is still a big physical intimidating force on the ice, and oroduces on the PP. 2 big holes the Habs have had for the past 3 years. If price does face more shots, I guarantee he'll see them all when Webber is out there.
There certainly is no denying that Subban didn't really fit in the Montreal locker room but his skill is undeniable. They could have got such a better return for him. It would be one thing if Weber was 3 years younger and they made this trade, but he already is declining and that contract is absolutely terrible. His shot suppression numbers were terrible last year, with him back there Price is going to be facing even more shots. Take a look at this chart
all these charts are skewed towards favouring offensive statistics. There are no real statistics for the things Webber does, besides hits. You say price will see more shots based off offensive stats. Where in that chart are the blocked shots and takeaways? Where's the "clearing bodies from the front of the net" stats, where's the "I dare you to come into this corner and get the puck" stats.
I get it. People love offense. People love the advanced stats. But they do not tell the story of what happens on the ice. My one real concern about Weber is his foot speed. If they put Weber with Markov, I'll be concerned. Weber is still a big physical intimidating force on the ice, and oroduces on the PP. 2 big holes the Habs have had for the past 3 years. If price does face more shots, I guarantee he'll see them all when Webber is out there.
The charts don't just favor offensive statistics. Corsi is about who has possession of the puck, and yes it is measured through shot attempts. Price will see more shots, its right there in Shot Suppression (Relative CA/60). When Weber was on the ice last year Nashville gave up way more shot attempts than when he was off the ice. When he was on the ice, the other team had the puck. This is what leads to those high number of blocked shots. You don't want your defensemen to have lots of blocked shots, it means they are trapped in their own end. Possession is crucial, the R squared valued of Corsi this season was .24 which is very high for a statistic, and Corsi leading teams are the ones that have been going deep in the playoffs.
Corsi is definitely not the end all be all of statistics. But just because Corsi is measured through shot attempts doesn't make it only an offensive statistic, it gives a picture for what is happening when that player is on the ice.
all these charts are skewed towards favouring offensive statistics. There are no real statistics for the things Webber does, besides hits. You say price will see more shots based off offensive stats. Where in that chart are the blocked shots and takeaways? Where's the "clearing bodies from the front of the net" stats, where's the "I dare you to come into this corner and get the puck" stats.
I get it. People love offense. People love the advanced stats. But they do not tell the story of what happens on the ice. My one real concern about Weber is his foot speed. If they put Weber with Markov, I'll be concerned. Weber is still a big physical intimidating force on the ice, and oroduces on the PP. 2 big holes the Habs have had for the past 3 years. If price does face more shots, I guarantee he'll see them all when Webber is out there.
The charts don't just favor offensive statistics. Corsi is about who has possession of the puck, and yes it is measured through shot attempts. Price will see more shots, its right there in Shot Suppression (Relative CA/60). When Weber was on the ice last year Nashville gave up way more shot attempts than when he was off the ice. When he was on the ice, the other team had the puck. This is what leads to those high number of blocked shots. You don't want your defensemen to have lots of blocked shots, it means they are trapped in their own end. Possession is crucial, the R squared valued of Corsi this season was .24 which is very high for a statistic, and Corsi leading teams are the ones that have been going deep in the playoffs.
Corsi is definitely not the end all be all of statistics. But just because Corsi is measured through shot attempts doesn't make it only an offensive statistic, it gives a picture for what is happening when that player is on the ice.
I disagree. Corsi does not take into account shot quality. If I'm rushing down the wing, and Weber is infront of me, I'm not looking around on the ice to make a pass and risk getting levelled. If he starts lining me up, I'm taking a dhot and protecting myself. I bet if you looked up shot attempts taken while Weber is on the ice, you'll see a ring pattern around the perimeter of Webbers defensive zone. Here's an article explaining Webers corsi numbers from a year ago: www.hockeyprospectus.com/digging-into-shea-webers-poor-relative-corsi/
For arguments sake, let's say Webers numbers are slipping in possession and corsi and all that. Was Weber ever a puck carrying D man? No. Is he a gifted passer? No. Subban is both of those things. Is Subban a dominant physical force on the ice? Once in a while, but generally no, not many players would be intimidated by Subban and feel the need to rush a shot or a pass. The opposite is true of Weber.
I will say that Subban obviously has more good years left in him, and he has many strengths that are far and above Webers abilities. But I will forever argue the fact that advanced stats don't always shot what's "actually" going on on the ice, and Webers strengths are far more important to a teams success than Subbans. At least in regards to the Habs.