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Wow, I saw the Muggs quite a few years back when my buddy's band was opening up for them in Chicago. It was a tiny venue (sh*t, if I can remember which one) and there were maybe 20-30 folks there for the show and that's including friends of the bands. Is it appropriate for me to say "I saw them when..." yet?
I actually learned about their appearance on the show through their mailing list, which I've been on for however long it has been since I saw them! They sound great though and for a band of middle-aged men playing classic garage rock to get exposure on a show like this is pretty awesome.
Post by oatmealschnappz on Oct 20, 2007 0:02:19 GMT -5
Smite away.
Great vocalists destroy any chance at credible careers on American Idol. This just seems like an extension of the same to me. Make it or don't. Just don't become a dancing monkey for network tv in the process. Appearing on bullshit talent shows like this may sell more records but, it drives away serious, long-term music fans.
Maybe I'm a schmuck but, I won't ever get my culture/art/music from "the new hit reality tv talent shows".
No matter how good your music may be, appearing on this kind of show is a deal-breaker in my world.
I watched the first season. Let's face it Kelly Clarkson is cute as a button and that chick can really sing but she had to work night and day to distance herself from that exploitovision crap to gain any real grasp at a career, and the grasp she has is shakey at best. I hope she milks it for all its worth and invests well
... and I can't even say Clay Aiken with a straight face
"I like too many things and get all confused and hung-up running from one falling star to another till I drop. This is the night, what it does to you. I had nothing to offer anybody except my own confusion."
central park in the summertime... the closest thing to nature
American Idol has produced the number one pop singer in Kelly Clarkson and the number one rock thing-I-dunno-even-what-to-call-it in Daughtry....
This is for people who are too lazy to go out looking for music. It's like really saying, "hey, America likes it, so should you!"
But hey, it's not exactly hurting anyone, just aggravating us music snobs. So I say let em continue with the crap, since it's not gonna be affecting me by being played on the tv and radio I don't listen to or watch. I mean, hey, we could even get another Sanjaya to be the next big Kanye.
Post by oatmealschnappz on Oct 23, 2007 13:31:58 GMT -5
juggernaut said:
oatmealschnappz said:
Smite away.
Great vocalists destroy any chance at credible careers on American Idol. This just seems like an extension of the same to me.
What is "credible"? Do you mean, in the eyes of the so-called non-mainstream? In that case, yes, of course. But they still establish themselves in the form of a career at all; the music industry is not the easiest business to break in to - doing this gives them a chance to have one shot at fleeting popularity and glory, which is more than most get.
They are "making it", just not in the way that YOU seem to think is authentic. I will agree with your second statement - it's been shown that people tend to view American Idol contestants as more of a disposable commodity than others, but isn't that the case with most pop music today?
Maybe I'm a schmuck but, I won't ever get my culture/art/music from "the new hit reality tv talent shows".
No matter how good your music may be, appearing on this kind of show is a deal-breaker in my world.
You obviously aren't their target audience. People need to realize that many people are casual music fans - they like simple things, popular things, and they don't take nuts too seriously. Complaints like this have been around for years - it used to be about radio (that radio only played he really popular artists, and ignored the more talented, independent artists), then MTV (same complaint, really), now American Idol and the like. Things never change.
You're right. I'm a jackass for not respecting primetime talent shows and the desperate pop wannabes that frequent them. Or am I a jackass for not being one of the simplistic drones that makes-up their target audience? Or maybe I'm a jackass for commenting on this subject? I forget. Oh, well. Rest assured, you put me in my place.
Last Edit: Oct 23, 2007 14:18:33 GMT -5 by oatmealschnappz - Back to Top
Post by oleander124 on Oct 23, 2007 14:22:39 GMT -5
oatmealschnappz said:
You're right. I'm a jackass for not respecting primetime talent shows and the desperate pop wannabes that frequent them. Or am I a jackass for not being one of the simplistic drones that makes-up their target audience? Or maybe I'm a jackass for commenting on this subject? I forget. Oh, well. Rest assured, you put me in my place.
Do you always assume people are calling you a "jackass" when they challenge/comment on what you say? I don't think he was even being negative towards your statement....
I've been accused of being a musical snob on more than one occasion, but I've got to say I enjoy American Idol. It may be a guilty pleasure but it is fun.
Post by steveternal on Oct 23, 2007 14:42:59 GMT -5
juggernaut said:
Complaints like this have been around for years - it used to be about radio (that radio only played he really popular artists, and ignored the more talented, independent artists), then MTV (same complaint, really), now American Idol and the like. Things never change.
You say that as if that proves the frivolity of those complaints. To me, the fact that they have had a consistent presence over the decades lends to its validity.
I think that constant pushing of the simplest, most emotionally accessible music will have very negative long term effects on the art and creative culture of our era. I know that sounds really drastic, and I don't mean to sound fanatically against some stupid little TV show about singers, but I believe it's the continuation of a problem that began back in the Enlightenment. To put it another way, we have shows like this because of other factors like that the general population are not getting the musical education that previous eras did. I'll keep my rant under 100 words and end it there.
Post by oatmealschnappz on Oct 23, 2007 14:43:28 GMT -5
oleander124 said:
oatmealschnappz said:
You're right. I'm a jackass for not respecting primetime talent shows and the desperate pop wannabes that frequent them. Or am I a jackass for not being one of the simplistic drones that makes-up their target audience? Or maybe I'm a jackass for commenting on this subject? I forget. Oh, well. Rest assured, you put me in my place.
Do you always assume people are calling you a "jackass" when they challenge/comment on what you say? I don't think he was even being negative towards your statement....
Read the posts. I simply expressed my view of shows like this. Juggernaut then disected my post in, what seems to me, like an attempt to trivialize and discredit my opinion. No. He didn't literaly call me a jackass but, he did respond rather dismissively. I didn't need him to point out that I wasn't their taget audience... I think that I had already made that abundantly clear. I didn't need him to question my use of the word "credible"... I know what it means and I used it exactly how it should be used. I don't think that it's fair or appropriate to say that I'm trying to dictate how these pathethic pop-star wannabes achieve "success"... I just don't respect it. That was all I was trying to say. I'm sorry if you don't approve of my wording but, it wasn't directed at you anyway.
....Do you always assume that it's your place to chastise me when I post something that you don't like or agree with? I don't think that I was being negative to you or him, so wtf?...
Last Edit: Oct 23, 2007 14:49:49 GMT -5 by oatmealschnappz - Back to Top
Post by oleander124 on Oct 23, 2007 14:53:49 GMT -5
oatmealschnappz said:
oleander124 said:
Do you always assume people are calling you a "jackass" when they challenge/comment on what you say? I don't think he was even being negative towards your statement....
Read the posts. I simply expressed my view of shows like this. Juggernaut then disected my post in, what seems to me, like an attempt to trivialize and discredit my opinion. No. He didn't literaly call me a jackass but, he did respond rather dismissively. I didn't need him to point out that I wasn't their taget audience... I think that I had already made that abundantly clear. I didn't need him to question my use of the word "credible"... I know what it means and I used it exactly how it should be used. I don't think that it's fair or appropriate to say that I'm trying to dictate how these pathethic pop-star wannabes achieve "success"... I just don't respect it. That was all I was trying to say. I'm sorry if you don't approve of my wording but, it wasn't directed at you anyway.
....Do you always assume that it's your place to chastise me when I post something that you don't like or agree with? I don't think that I was being negative to you or him, so wtf?...
Woosh. Take a chill pill. I'm not the only one that had the same thought, jesus. I in NO WAY chastised you. Damn.
Post by blackbirdflyfree on Oct 23, 2007 23:53:54 GMT -5
carrie underwood's been super successful too...
I just see the whole reality show phenomenon as people taking the easy road to fame. the people who go on the shows either don't want to put in the hard work of creating themselves as an artist and taking years to hone their craft (although some are lucky and get big quickly by chance) or see trying out a reality show as a way to try a career in music (or even acting for some shows, like the real world folk) without devoting a lot of time and work into it. the bands and musicians and actors that I really respect took a big chance by dedicating their lives to their work rather than putting it aside to get a job to make money. but it doesn't mean that people like kelly clarkson aren't incredibly talented. she can totally sing!!
wasn't kelly having a ton of trouble doing the music that she wanted too? american idol-like shows pretty much force the contestants into a certain type of music career because they aren't established artists, which also comes with the hard work.
that's just how I see it. sorry if I rambled. and a difference in opinion doesn't make anyone a jackass!
"I like too many things and get all confused and hung-up running from one falling star to another till I drop. This is the night, what it does to you. I had nothing to offer anybody except my own confusion."
central park in the summertime... the closest thing to nature
Post by oleander124 on Oct 24, 2007 7:34:24 GMT -5
Thanks for the smites, people.
I believe the 4 people that smited me took what I said the wrong way. I was just commenting on the fact that jesus shouldn't automatically assume the juggernaut was trying to be "dismissive" of his comments by quoting and then responding with his own opinions. I didn't find the juggernaut's response to be derogatory at all. I saw it as a way of having a discussion with him on his comments. I didn't think jesus should have gotten so defensive with his comment on being a jackass and rolling his eyes. My comment was more of a way to communicate to jesus that no one thinks he is a jackass by what he said and having his own opinion. I certainly don't think that and I even agree with some of the things he said, as well as the juggernaut.
Besides, I wasn't the only one that commented on jesus's quick jump to be defensive and roll his eyes at the juggernaut's opinion. If you all took what I said to be mean in the first place, chalk it up to your own internet interpretation.
ps--I'm not trying to stir things up again...just commenting on the fact that some people obviously took my comment the wrong way.
I'd rather watch talented musicians make one last attempt to make it big by "selling out" than watch messed up relationships blow up, fat people go to extreme lengths to lose weight and families invite a stranger into their home to rile up the children and make all parties cry.
I'll admit it, I watch these shows and was a big fan of both seasons of Rockstar - not because I really cared what happened to the bands at the end (ew and RIP the real INXS), but to see all this untapped talent out there and to see how America reacts to music - what they find good and bad. It's an interesting sociological experiment. Often the voters compeltely go against what the bigwigs think are going to sell. It fascinates me.
I have a friend who is in a band, has been going at it for about 15 years. They have a loyal following in the area, play at least 3 times a week and are still having fun, playing their sort of music, not fitting a label but still being loved. Well my friend is 33, he has a kid and a wife and he's wondering where this is all going - will they grow, are they just not getting the right people to hear them? Should he cuit down and concentrate on a career? he now has a fam to think of.
So they applied for one of these shows. They figured it's now or never - they are all mid 20's to mid 30's and love what they do, but at a point if you don't have the right audience you sort of get stuck in band limbo and they are there.
They weren't accepted. Again, don't remember what show it was - may have been this one. But they took it as a sign to make the music still their passion, but they now feel they did it their way, they tried it the big money way and neither have hit paydirt so they are going to concentrate more on their families. Sad, but that's the reality for most musicians.
Then I have my other firend who travels the entire US in his beat up Saturn playing coffee shops with his partner and lives on couches of fans and in the Saturn and thinks his life is utterly grand and desires no more. But he doesn't have children/mortgage/etc. and can be a musical wanderer. Everyone's reasons are different.
Also, with Rockstar, some of the singers on there had been at it for years, some already had their own bands and when they didn't win, their careers were able to take off. But this was a way of getting a national audience rather than just a regional one.
Also, with Rockstar, some of the singers on there had been at it for years, some already had their own bands and when they didn't win, their careers were able to take off. But this was a way of getting a national audience rather than just a regional one.
Hey, what are you doing here? Getting into the Bonnaroo spirit with the cooler temps?
