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It is really important to question all sides of the story and not just fall for a sleek MTV style video. Without question Kony is a very bad man, but be sure to be fully informed.
I posted this in Random Thoughts, but it should go here too, I guess:
That's a photo of the "non-profit" d-bags that made this film. Calling these guys "shady" is not doing justice to just how scummy they are. They profit off of death, plain and simple. A small portion of their revenue goes to actual charities and they refuse to give the BBB the proper information to accurately investigate the numerous claims against the Invisible Children "charity" group.
The video is from 2003, for the record. They are basically taking something 9 years old and presenting it as a current event.
They're misrepresent the current state of Northern Uganda with this money-grab bullsh!t. Northern Uganda has been free of LRA war and violence for 5 years now. Kony is on the run, if he's not already dead, and has been on the run for more than a year. Recruitment of children to the LRA is down 80%, and not because these douchey war mongerers decided to "open our eyes," it's because the Ugandan military intervened years ago. They are grouping together multiple conflicts and presenting it as a single war.
This is an ACTUAL quote from the Invisible Children spokesperson after being questioned on their shady tactics: “I agree with you that leading people to believe that the war is still happening in Uganda is not ethically right. It's something we've been addressing internally, focusing on getting all staff and supporters on the same page (of communication)." Nice.
The fact of the matter is these conflicts (plural) have been in the news for years, but people don't give a sh!t because it doesn't directly impact their day-to-day lives. But, when celebrities start tweeting about something it's all-of-a-sudden the biggest effing deal EVARRRR! Is Joseph Kony a bad man? Yes, he is. But presenting the Ugandan government, who is guilty of mass murder, kidnapping and using child soldiers, as faultless in this conflict is irresponsible. Invisible Children just picked one side of a conflict whose two participants are both bad. Joseph Kony will be dead within the next 6 months (again, if he isn't already killed) and his LRA group has little-to-no power in Africa, THAT should be the news.
I don't mean to be a jerkstore, but this just pisses me off. This isn't news, it's been an ongoing struggle that no one ever seemed to care about until it caught the eyes and ears of celebrities. It's a sad indictment on our American culture and basically leaves me hopeless that my generation has the brain power and common sense to succeed as a whole.
You guys know that you dont have to donate right? I think the viral video is doing some good just by raising awareness of the situation. As annoying as it might be to see the KONY 2012 video popup on your twitter feed when youre trying to find out the latest on the Kardashian sisters, it is still raising awareness. Everyone from political figures, celebrities and people like you and me. As previously suggested in an earlier post, do your homework before donating and donate to the charity that you feel will have the most impact. Dont just turn your head and say "this KONY thing is sooo annoying OMG" . Do something instead of being the cynics of the world.
Support what you feel is right, its your choice....
I posted this in Random Thoughts, but it should go here too, I guess:
That's a photo of the "non-profit" d-bags that made this film. Calling these guys "shady" is not doing justice to just how scummy they are. They profit off of death, plain and simple. A small portion of their revenue goes to actual charities and they refuse to give the BBB the proper information to accurately investigate the numerous claims against the Invisible Children "charity" group.
The video is from 2003, for the record. They are basically taking something 9 years old and presenting it as a current event.
They're misrepresent the current state of Northern Uganda with this money-grab bullsh!t. Northern Uganda has been free of LRA war and violence for 5 years now. Kony is on the run, if he's not already dead, and has been on the run for more than a year. Recruitment of children to the LRA is down 80%, and not because these douchey war mongerers decided to "open our eyes," it's because the Ugandan military intervened years ago. They are grouping together multiple conflicts and presenting it as a single war.
This is an ACTUAL quote from the Invisible Children spokesperson after being questioned on their shady tactics: “I agree with you that leading people to believe that the war is still happening in Uganda is not ethically right. It's something we've been addressing internally, focusing on getting all staff and supporters on the same page (of communication)." Nice.
The fact of the matter is these conflicts (plural) have been in the news for years, but people don't give a sh!t because it doesn't directly impact their day-to-day lives. But, when celebrities start tweeting about something it's all-of-a-sudden the biggest effing deal EVARRRR! Is Joseph Kony a bad man? Yes, he is. But presenting the Ugandan government, who is guilty of mass murder, kidnapping and using child soldiers, as faultless in this conflict is irresponsible. Invisible Children just picked one side of a conflict whose two participants are both bad. Joseph Kony will be dead within the next 6 months (again, if he isn't already killed) and his LRA group has little-to-no power in Africa, THAT should be the news.
I don't mean to be a jerkstore, but this just pisses me off. This isn't news, it's been an ongoing struggle that no one ever seemed to care about until it caught the eyes and ears of celebrities. It's a sad indictment on our American culture and basically leaves me hopeless that my generation has the brain power and common sense to succeed as a whole.
Thank you omar. Now go inform every single person via facebook of this because i am too lazy to do it.
You guys know that you dont have to donate right? I think the viral video is doing some good just by raising awareness of the situation. As annoying as it might be to see the KONY 2012 video popup on your twitter feed when youre trying to find out the latest on the Kardashian sisters, it is still raising awareness. Everyone from political figures, celebrities and people like you and me. As previously suggested in an earlier post, do your homework before donating and donate to the charity that you feel will have the most impact. Dont just turn your head and say "this KONY thing is sooo annoying OMG" . Do something instead of being the cynics of the world.
Support what you feel is right, its your choice....
It is annoying, but not because I'm being flooded with charity donation posts, but because it's not a charity, it's a scam. People are openly campaigning to get scammed.
Welcome back Bonz, but I do not find it strange that your presence being requested in the Orgy thread and then you showing up, like it was the quacking Bonzai Bat Signal.
You guys know that you dont have to donate right? I think the viral video is doing some good just by raising awareness of the situation. As annoying as it might be to see the KONY 2012 video popup on your twitter feed when youre trying to find out the latest on the Kardashian sisters, it is still raising awareness. Everyone from political figures, celebrities and people like you and me. As previously suggested in an earlier post, do your homework before donating and donate to the charity that you feel will have the most impact. Dont just turn your head and say "this KONY thing is sooo annoying OMG" . Do something instead of being the cynics of the world.
Support what you feel is right, its your choice....
It's not even being a cynic and hating on everyone posting this. I agree with you completely that it is doing some good by raising awareness about the situation at all levels. It's just the people that i am seeing posting this video and sharing it everywhere that is getting me annoyed. Because most of these people. a) Probably didn't donate anything at all. To any organization including IC. b) Most likely haven't known this type of conflict was going on in Uganda for years before 2012 (as omar said the video is from 2003)
Now i'm no saint, and i it's not like i do a ton of charity work or donations, i just get annoyed when i see half of facebook people post a video when probably less than 1% did anything about it at all.
The BBB is for-profit organization. I am against the BBB in every form, although it may help consumers get desired results in non-desirable circumstances, it's ruthless the way they back some small businesses in the corner and threaten to lower their rating (Oh no! Not my BBB rating!!!) if a positive resolution isn't met. And guess what--- they don't decide what a positive resolution is, the consumer with the issue ultimately decides that!!!
I'm not taking one side or another with this whole Invisible Children/KONY2012 thing. HOWEVER, if I was Invisible Children I would stay as far away from the BBB as possible.
The BBB is for-profit organization. I am against the BBB in every form, although it may help consumers get desired results in non-desirable circumstances, it's ruthless the way they back some small businesses in the corner and threaten to lower their rating (Oh no! Not my BBB rating!!!) if a positive resolution isn't met. And guess what--- they don't decide what a positive resolution is, the consumer with the issue ultimately decides that!!!
I'm not taking one side or another with this whole Invisible Children/KONY2012 thing. HOWEVER, if I was Invisible Children I would stay as far away from the BBB as possible.
I don't disagree with this, to be honest. It's reminiscent of Moody's and S&P's shady rating system. But it's just one of many shady things IC has done, so while you may be right on the BBB as a whole, it still doesn't take away from the fact that IC is a for-profit company parading as a not-for-profit charity.
Post by itrainmonkeys on Mar 8, 2012 10:00:14 GMT -5
I just dislike it when people don't think for themselves. Just watch a video and repost it without any research.
Also, I doubt most of the people posting it on my facebook feed are actually doing anything about it. I'm sure most of them aren't donating or looking into things. Just posting a video to say "Look how bad this is! How can we let this happen?" then going about their day.
You guys know that you dont have to donate right? I think the viral video is doing some good just by raising awareness of the situation. As annoying as it might be to see the KONY 2012 video popup on your twitter feed when youre trying to find out the latest on the Kardashian sisters, it is still raising awareness. Everyone from political figures, celebrities and people like you and me. As previously suggested in an earlier post, do your homework before donating and donate to the charity that you feel will have the most impact. Dont just turn your head and say "this KONY thing is sooo annoying OMG" . Do something instead of being the cynics of the world.
Support what you feel is right, its your choice....
Couldnt have said it better myself.
I know after watching the video last night I got my CC out and donated. I guess I'm ignorant and niave? Though I dont think my money just went to supporting a terrorist or anything.
Last Edit: Mar 8, 2012 10:17:30 GMT -5 by Deleted - Back to Top
$30 for the action kit $5 for 25 posters and $10 for just that squished nickel with a few numbers stamped on it. I wonder how much this guy pays for his plane tickets to and from Africa as well as other expensices. I doubt the invisible children organization have paid out of pocket for any individual expences since that action kit money started rolling in
I'm sure invisible children has done a lot of good raising awareness and obviously kony and others like him need to be stopped but I just like to know my money goes to what it says, not to the people in charge to do with what they please
I know after watching the video last night I got my CC out and donated. I guess I'm ignorant and niave? Though I dont think my money just went to supporting a terrorist or anything.
I wouldn't donate without doing a little research.
You guys know that you dont have to donate right? I think the viral video is doing some good just by raising awareness of the situation. As annoying as it might be to see the KONY 2012 video popup on your twitter feed when youre trying to find out the latest on the Kardashian sisters, it is still raising awareness. Everyone from political figures, celebrities and people like you and me. As previously suggested in an earlier post, do your homework before donating and donate to the charity that you feel will have the most impact. Dont just turn your head and say "this KONY thing is sooo annoying OMG" . Do something instead of being the cynics of the world.
Support what you feel is right, its your choice....
Couldnt have said it better myself.
I know after watching the video last night I got my CC out and donated. I guess I'm ignorant and niave? Though I dont think my money just went to supporting a terrorist or anything.
You guys are missing the point entirely.
IC is a company, it's not a not-for-profit organization. They are likely going to pocket at least 80% of the money that you donated. The US is already aiding in the pursuit/capture of Kony, and the region depicted in the video hasn't had LRA violence in half a decade.
I am not saying IC is "supporting terrorists," not even close. What I am saying is that IC is a shady business that presents itself as a non-profit who indeed takes a profit. They're being investigated by Uganda as the #1 fraudulent business in the nation, because of all the shadiness that surrounds them.
Your heart's in the right place, you just reacted too quickly and didn't look into IC. I'm not faulting you for being a good guy and donating money, but I highly doubt that money ends up buying goods to benefit the people of Central and Northern Africa.
Last Edit: Mar 8, 2012 10:29:42 GMT -5 by flanzonyc - Back to Top
Post by itrainmonkeys on Mar 8, 2012 10:30:23 GMT -5
I agree with Flanzo. To me, this isn't an issue because it's annoying to see it on my facebook and twitter feed. It's an issue because they are getting people to donate money without thinking where the money is actually going/how it will help.
This thread is an example of the success KONY is having by raising awareness. No matter who you donate your money too all they initially ask is to spread the word and post the vid. From that point on, do your homework and make your own decision when it comes to donating. How many of you that are bashing IC have donated to any of the other groups mentioned in some of these external links. I feel like everyone on this thread is trying to say the same thing, which is good. Lets all get away from the fact that IC might not be the charity of your choice. With that out of the way what negative affects has this video had?
This thread is an example of the success KONY is having by raising awareness. No matter who you donate your money too all they initially ask is to spread the word and post the vid. From that point on, do your homework and make your own decision when it comes to donating. How many of you that are bashing IC have donated to any of the other groups mentioned in some of these external links. I feel like everyone on this thread is trying to say the same thing, which is good. Lets all get away from the fact that IC might not be the charity of your choice. With that out of the way what negative affects has this video had?
I feel like you're still missing the point. This isn't raising awareness, because the events & situation depicted in that video doesn't exist anymore. In 2003, when the video was filmed, it was indeed a huge issue, except no one cared to talk about it. Now it's 2012 and they're showing footage from 2003 as if it was taken yesterday while saying "HELP US NOW!" Who are you helping? Where is your money going? If you can't trace where your money goes, as a general rule of thumb it's likely not going where you want it to. There are dozens of charities that truly help these regions. So if awareness is what you want, post the video but advise that it is an outdated video, and that the people who made it are shady. Donate to a charity that has no association with the video and/or the company that made it.
The negative effect that this video can have is a nation of privileged youth amassing a campaign for a revenge killing, despite the fact that 99% of those people have no knowledge of the reality of the situation, or the history behind the conflict. Do I know everything about what's happened there? No. But I do follow current events like this on a regular basis, so I have at least a solid idea, and I also know what IC is doing is unethical. It's not a charity, and that's where I think the issue is. They're asking for donations as a non-profit when they do in fact make a profit.
Im not saying that this HAS to go to KONY. I understand what youre saying completely (in fact I agree with EVERYTHING your saying) Ive been dating an International Development Major for 8 years...it has been driven into me like a nail!! lol.I know that this isnt new news. What I am saying is that because of this video it is sparking conversation such as this and it is getting people to look deeper into these issues. Which means that other organizations like you are talking about are automatically getting more recognition. By no means at all am I saying that you should donate to KONY or any other organization for that matter. Thats YOUR call! Awareness is all Im about, just as you are.
Flanzo, ITM - IMO, although I agree with you in PRINCIPLE, I feel like your focus is off the mark a bit. There are a lot of people regurgitating what they heard, and sprinkling in their own spin and opinions to try to get their point across and to get people to see it your way.
First of all, this situation did not end in 2003. It moved out of Uganda in 2003 (slowly) into other regions. Uganda's government, military and citizens - with help of other groups INCLUDING International Children pushed them out of their country. Win. But are they gone? No. Are they still kidnapping kids from Uganda? Yes. Are the numbers of kidnappings DOWN? Yes. Is the problem gone? Not even close.
Spin it how you want, this man, Kony, is an awful person, and has caused some serious problems for the region that will be felt for decades. (get rid of him, the brainwashed don't immediately 'come to'... a good amount of them believe in what they are doing....whatever they think it might be)
This video is creating awareness for people who are too lazy to find this information on their own. For example: Something not addressed in the video is the fact that the LRA injects pre-teens (and younger) with a mixture of heroin and gunpowder to make them dependent upon them for drugs, and a little crazy. This has been common practice in the LRA for many, many years. Do most people know this? no. Is it real? Yes. Should it be stopped? ABSOLUTELY.
And, ITM, flanzo - although I understand where you are coming from - convincing people that IC is a scam, and trying to convince Phi that he did something wrong is unfair. And inaccurate.
Their financials are on display for anyone to see. Yes, the people involved make a living. They SHOULD. Yes, they spent money making a video to spread awareness. It costs money to do that. Is SOME of the material and video in this new video a little dated? Yup. But what does it matter? I mean REALLY. What does it matter? This is still going on. Today. Right now as you read this post, there are 11 year olds being shot up with heroin and gunpowder and given an AK47. And if it takes some 'annoying' awareness to make an impact on this - well... deal with it. Buy a box of straws and suck it the hell up and deal with it. I will never complain of being annoyed if it means saving the life or future of one child. You shouldn't either.
Another thing in this thread that is bothersome is this: Some of you are pointing out how nobody is educated on the matter, and someone else says "probably 80% goes in their pockets" or something to that effect. This is grossly inaccurate and simply carelessly and fallaciously stated with no proof or even reference as to where they read it or even heard it. Its a ludicrous guess at something that can be researched.
Here is the breakdown:
2011: 8,894,630 collected.
3,303,228 went to Central Africa programs including scholarships, schools, teachers, MEND and other programs creating jobs and education.
3,010,105 went to Awareness programs including touring around to raise awareness, creating the video, websites, communications, Schools for Schools (a US charity), events, conferences, Political advocacy and other programs to spread the word. Yes, their travel expenses were paid out of this portion, but how else could they get the word out?
1,444,567 Managerial and General. This is not very high, considering how many people work for this organization full time. And none of the officers of this organization make more than 200,000 a year. Compare that to 50-75 million for the bankers who are directly stealing from you and I RIGHT NOW, its a pittance. And this is important work, IMO.
That totals 7,757,900 of the 8,894,630 collected in 2011.
They spent over 850K on awareness products (the bracelets, t-shirts, posters, DVDs, MEND, etc) to spread the word and raise money for the cause.
So don't spout a number like "They are likely to pocket at least 80% of what you donated" without looking into it. You are way off base.
And I don't have any idea who things that raising awareness and money to help stop the kidnapping and subsequent exploitation and brainwashing of innocent children as unethical.
This is going on RIGHT NOW. Has it slowed? a bit, yes. But if Phi's 30-50$ can help to make children safer it is WORTH IT. So don't make him feel like a fool for doing something GOOD.
And don't bust on other people for wanting to help, but not doing research - then commit the exact same sin.
I do have an issue with the filmmakers because of the self promotional way the video was done. It takes a very serious global crisis and turns it into some pompous art-indie flick. It takes an honest cause and dilutes it with vanity.
But raising international awareness against Joseph Kony is a good thing. He is a very, very, very, bad man. He's on the World's Most Wanted list for crimes against humanity. Kony and his LRA have been linked to violence in Sudan, Uganda, and the Congo. His army has committed mass rapes, in one horrific instance, an entire boarding school for girls. His army has abducted children and in some cases, for initiation as a soldier, they are forced to murder their own parents. Joseph Kony is a renegade warlord and he his still on the run. He has evaded the US since 2010.
If you have gripes with how their donations are handled or the validity of the filmmakers. Those are reasonable. But don't be so cynical about the ends it is trying to achieve.
Jason Russell, the filmmaker behind the mega-viral "Kony 2012" documentary, was arrested in San Diego on Thursday night, NBC reported, citing the San Diego Police Department.
Russell, 33, "was taken into custody after he was found masturbating in public, vandalizing cars and possibly under the influence of something," NBC's San Diego affiliate reported, citing San Diego Police Department spokeswoman Lt. Andra Brown.