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Post by A$AP Rosko on Feb 11, 2013 15:28:57 GMT -5
I'll admit it, I have a pretentious taste in film, guys. I legitimately enjoy movies that most people would classify as pretentious. I'm more interested in seeing old foreign films (by people like Godard and Bergmann, both of whom I haven't seen nearly enough films by) that I haven't seen than seeing big, entertaining blockbusters like Star Wars. Citizen Kane is my favorite movie of all time. Those are just the kinds of movies that interest me. But I'm not gonna go around accosting those who haven't seen Citizen Kane even though it's widely considered the greatest film of all time and demanding that they watch it. I have a different taste in movies, guys; sorry for that.
And for the record, I'm not OPPOSED to seeing Star Wars as an adult and I'm sure they're good films, there's just a lot of other films that are higher on my priority list.
I'll admit it, I have a pretentious taste in film, guys. I legitimately enjoy movies that most people would classify as pretentious. I'm more interested in seeing old foreign films (by people like Godard and Bergmann, both of whom I haven't seen nearly enough films by) that I haven't seen than seeing big, entertaining blockbusters like Star Wars. Citizen Kane is my favorite movie of all time. Those are just the kinds of movies that interest me. But I'm not gonna go around accosting those who haven't seen Citizen Kane even though it's widely considered the greatest film of all time and demanding that they watch it. I have a different taste in movies, guys; sorry for that.
And for the record, I'm not OPPOSED to seeing Star Wars as an adult and I'm sure they're good films, there's just a lot of other films that are higher on my priority list.
I've found that the sheer magnitude of these films makes a lot of other things more enjoyable. There are tons and tons of allusions to Star Wars within other films and TV series since then. They're all great films, and would be worthy of the hype regardless of the constant references, but it's just another reason to consider seeing them. Though these references are probably not going to be in too many films/shows you watch, and a large number of them you'll catch without ever actually seeing the trilogy.
I'll admit it, I have a pretentious taste in film, guys. I legitimately enjoy movies that most people would classify as pretentious. I'm more interested in seeing old foreign films (by people like Godard and Bergmann, both of whom I haven't seen nearly enough films by) that I haven't seen than seeing big, entertaining blockbusters like Star Wars. Citizen Kane is my favorite movie of all time. Those are just the kinds of movies that interest me. But I'm not gonna go around accosting those who haven't seen Citizen Kane even though it's widely considered the greatest film of all time and demanding that they watch it. I have a different taste in movies, guys; sorry for that.
And for the record, I'm not OPPOSED to seeing Star Wars as an adult and I'm sure they're good films, there's just a lot of other films that are higher on my priority list.
I've found that the sheer magnitude of these films makes a lot of other things more enjoyable. There are tons and tons of allusions to Star Wars within other films and TV series since then. They're all great films, and would be worthy of the hype regardless of the constant references, but it's just another reason to consider seeing them. Though these references are probably not going to be in too many films/shows you watch, and a large number of them you'll catch without ever actually seeing the trilogy.
I think Kyle would agree with that. Fact is Star Wars is, itself, an interesting take on Kurosawa's Seven Samurai, just set in space.
Post by A$AP Rosko on Feb 11, 2013 15:58:00 GMT -5
^^ That was why I brought up knowing most of the cultural touchstones of Star Wars; not to suggest that playing "just the tip" with Star Wars (kudos for that phrase, Flanz) is the same as seeing all the movies all the way through, but just to point out that I know enough about it to pick up on the references that are made to Star Wars.
^Tom, I love that movie. That's what I was gonna say in response to Dave's post about Star Wars being able to be set anywhere, but I thought that would be too pretentious (haha).
Welcome back Bonz, but I do not find it strange that your presence being requested in the Orgy thread and then you showing up, like it was the quacking Bonzai Bat Signal.
Sorry, A$AP Rosko.... I accidentally started the resurgence of this thread... Tis my fault
I think Dave would've found out and started accosting me about it regardless, haha. He was bound to find out that bit of information and then endlessly hound me about it, it's just his way
Post by chicojuarz on Feb 11, 2013 18:11:52 GMT -5
Star Wars is just a well-made play. Per wikipedia.
The form has a strong neoclassical flavour, involving a very tight plot and a climax that takes place very close to the end of the action, with most of the story taking place before the action of the play; much of the information regarding such previous action would be revealed through thinly veiled exposition. Following that would be a series of causally-related plot complications.
A recurrent device that the well-made play employs is the use of letters or papers falling into unintended hands, in order to bring about plot twists and climaxes. Following the recommendations found in Aristotle's Poetics, the letters must bring about an unexpected reversal of fortune, in which it is often revealed that someone is not who they pretend to be. The reversal will allow for a quick dénouement, and a return to order, at which point the curtain falls.
The techniques of well-made plays also lend themselves to comedies of situation, often farce. In The Quintessence of Ibsenism, Bernard Shaw proposed that Ibsen converted this formula for use in "serious" plays by substituting discussion for the plausible dénouement or conclusion. Thus, plays become open-ended, as if there were life for the protagonists beyond the last act curtain.
Sorry, A$AP Rosko.... I accidentally started the resurgence of this thread... Tis my fault
I think Dave would've found out and started accosting me about it regardless, haha. He was bound to find out that bit of information and then endlessly hound me about it, it's just his way
Was he not in chat the other night when were giving you a hard time about Star Wars? When I recommended Joseph Campbell to you...
Sorry, A$AP Rosko.... I accidentally started the resurgence of this thread... Tis my fault
I think Dave would've found out and started accosting me about it regardless, haha. He was bound to find out that bit of information and then endlessly hound me about it, it's just his way
I accost because I care.
I think, for a certain age, Star Wars is probably the most culturally important movie in existence. If you want to look at it from a film history perspective, Star Wars is the movie that would most would consider the first modern blockbuster and/or "event" movie. It really changed things in the way summer movies were put out there and marketed.
I wouldn't call you bringing Seven Samurai into the conversation pretentious because that is the exact thing I am talking about. Star Wars gets unfairly pigeonholed a lot into the whole "SPECIAL EFFECTS! eXPLOSIONS! LAYZORS!" pile when it is better than that. I am not trying to say it is the best written movie ever (it's not), but there is a lot more going on than it gets credit for especially with the horribly awkward writing of the prequels stinking up the legacy.
I think Dave would've found out and started accosting me about it regardless, haha. He was bound to find out that bit of information and then endlessly hound me about it, it's just his way
I think, for a certain age, Star Wars is probably the most culturally important movie in existence.
I think Dave would've found out and started accosting me about it regardless, haha. He was bound to find out that bit of information and then endlessly hound me about it, it's just his way
Star Wars gets unfairly pigeonholed a lot into the whole "SPECIAL EFFECTS! eXPLOSIONS! LAYZORS!" pile when it is better than that. I am not trying to say it is the best written movie ever (it's not), but there is a lot more going on than it gets credit for
These kind of contradict each other; which one is it? Is Star Wars this cultural landmark of a film? (the answer is yes...although I might take issue with you calling it THE most culturally important movie in existence, even for a certain age)
Is Star Wars unfairly pigeonholed, with a lot more going on than it gets credit for? (I think no; it gets TONS of credit...I just think it probably isn't my kind of movie)
Post by Dave Maynar on Feb 11, 2013 22:07:54 GMT -5
I don't think they contradict each other at all. The two statements look at different aspects of the film. It is, at least, a very important movie from a cultural standpoint for a certain age demographic. Tons and tons of people have seen it, and it's a movie that people frequently "grow up" with. At the same time, many only look at the whiz bang special effects aspect of the movie as the basis for their appreciation for the movie when it has more going on from a writing standpoint.
I don't think they contradict each other at all. The two statements look at different aspects of the film. It is, at least, a very important movie from a cultural standpoint for a certain age demographic. Tons and tons of people have seen it, and it's a movie that people frequently "grow up" with. At the same time, many only look at the whiz bang special effects aspect of the movie as the basis for their appreciation for the movie when it has more going on from a writing standpoint.
I don't know, I think you're misappropriating people's appreciation for it. Who are you to say why certain people enjoy a certain movie? Isn't that a little condescending to Star Wars' general audience? I know that Star Wars gets a lot of credit for the Shakespearean overtones of its story arc. Again, I'm not claiming that Star Wars isn't worthy of my viewership or that it isn't critically acclaimed enough for me (it has plenty of critical acclaim, even aside from its commercial success, and those critics certainly praise it for its writing); I'm just saying that it doesn't seem like my kind of movie(s), so the trilogy is a little lower on my queue than certain other things that seem more up my alley.
I don't think they contradict each other at all. The two statements look at different aspects of the film. It is, at least, a very important movie from a cultural standpoint for a certain age demographic. Tons and tons of people have seen it, and it's a movie that people frequently "grow up" with. At the same time, many only look at the whiz bang special effects aspect of the movie as the basis for their appreciation for the movie when it has more going on from a writing standpoint.
Not to speak for you, but by writing - that is more applicable to the storylines and descriptions. The dialogue writing can be a bit corny at times. Even as a kid, I picked up on that. But the basic story that has been told a zillion times has really only been written/told that well a few times in our lives.
Post by Dave Maynar on Feb 11, 2013 22:19:00 GMT -5
I never said that the trilogy wasn't critically acclaimed enough for your liking. In fact, I was supporting you bringing Seven Samurai into the conversation by stating that I did not find the comparison pretentious as the trilogy is worthy of serious discussion on its literary themes which I will still say is underappreciated as I have seen way more documentaries and specials on how they made Jabba the Hut blink than Vader's moral purification through self sacrifice.
the trilogy is worthy of serious discussion on its literary themes which I will still say is underappreciated as I have seen way more documentaries and specials on how they made Jabba the Hut blink than Vader's moral purification through self sacrifice.
Alright, fair enough. But I would say you shouldn't assume that other viewers/fans of Star Wars haven't picked up on this as well.
Not to speak for you, but by writing - that is more applicable to the storylines and descriptions. The dialogue writing can be a bit corny at times. Even as a kid, I picked up on that. But the basic story that has been told a zillion times has really only been written/told that well a few times in our lives.
Most definitely. Lucas is an idea man not a details man. This is evidenced in that the best movies in the series are the ones that are not solely written and directed by him. He needs someone to take his vision and make it flow.
the trilogy is worthy of serious discussion on its literary themes which I will still say is underappreciated as I have seen way more documentaries and specials on how they made Jabba the Hut blink than Vader's moral purification through self sacrifice.
Alright, fair enough. But I would say you shouldn't assume that other viewers/fans of Star Wars haven't picked up on this as well.
I never said that I am the only one who has picked up on this. I just said that it is an aspect of the trilogy that is underrated.
Welcome back Bonz, but I do not find it strange that your presence being requested in the Orgy thread and then you showing up, like it was the quacking Bonzai Bat Signal.
I just want to clarify that I am playing up the anger for comedic effect. I'm not actually mad or disappointed in you at all. If anything, I am just surprised that you have never seen it since it is one of those movies that everyone has seen, you know?
I know you probably wouldn't think it was all that based off what I know of your movie history. You might like it more than you expect though. There is definitely more depth to it than there is to Indiana Jones.
I just want to clarify that I am playing up the anger for comedic effect. I'm not actually mad or disappointed in you at all. If anything, I am just surprised that you have never seen it since it is one of those movies that everyone has seen, you know?
I know you probably wouldn't think it was all that based off what I know of your movie history. You might like it more than you expect though. There is definitely more depth to it than there is to Indiana Jones.
Oh, I know you are, man. I get it. I'm playing along, too.
And as for your second paragraph, that kind of tempering of expectations is the kind of thing that makes me want to see it more. I'll probably run through it at some point this summer.
but I do not find it strange that your presence being requested in the Orgy thread and then you showing up, like it was the quacking Bonzai Bat Signal. 
on it. 
