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Also, WLViking, how is it NOT spin when you make up some blatant BS about me having a tendency to late stack the first person who stacks. That's 100% undeniably not true. And you "agreeing to disagree" is just complete horsesh!t. Anyone who plays this game often enough with me knows that you're making up some complete BS. I almost always vote early in the round. Waaaaaay more often than not.
In the last 5 games excluding the invitational (Where you voted in the later half), you have voted 7th, 4th, 8th, 10th, and 11th. And your votes have typically been in response to a stack or other player action. Conveniently, you have deleted your old posts, but the voting records do not lie. I could keep going back, but I think this proves my point. Just remember, when you delete your posts, quotes and voting records still stand. So I have to ask, what did I make up?
And as for novels, I think my explanations have been pretty brief this game. I just take time to actually think about what I post instead of half-@ssing it.
Man, I deleted my posts like 2 weeks ago. And as for those "statistics" - its BS. Again, everyone knows what my voting tendencies are, so I'll leave it up to them to decide whether you're making up BS.
Tajas >> Hakuna >> Bacon Ella >> LD Ody >> Bogart Krissy >> LD Bogart >> Ody Viking >> Bacon >> Jimmy LD >> Krissy Sleepy >> Jimmy Jimmy >> Viking Hakuna >> Tejas Bacon >> Viking
Left to vote
Voting remains open. As of now I plan on closing voting tomorrow night 10PM BST (Bonnaroo Standard Time (yes, that's Central time as well)) If there are vote changes close to closing time I will make the call as to let it go to Saturday or close it. If you anyone feels the need for an extension feel free to send me a PM.
Ideally, I would prefer Bacon to LD in this runoff for 3 reasons. First, LD will get ignored, due to the polarization between Jimmy and I. He is not involved in the current back and forth and really has not done anything to warrent getting tossed in now. Second, Bacon is voting for me. It really is not much and admittedly I have no reason to think he is mafia other than that reason, but knowing I am a townie, it is all I have. His vote for me makes him involved even if only by a slim margin. Lastly, I think LD is better left to Day 2 to figure out. Day 1, we do not have too much so we sort through what we can. Typically though, people in the Day 1 runoff get a pass Day 2, and since we cannot lean one way or the other, I would prefer not to give out passes.
Of course, this is all my opinion, and I would love to hear from the rest of the town. Off to bed. Night everyone.
I really don't see where tying up all connections to a single argument in the runoff is going to be particularly helpful right now, especially with yesterday's word of polarization being thrown around. Beyond being the early voter, Bacon really hasn't done much to warrant suspicion in my opinion.
I really can't get a good reading on Bacon just yet; he could just as easily be a quiet townie or a low-laying mafia. There's just far too little content to go on at the moment - although in my experience mafia aren't typically the first out of the gate with votes, so I'll give him the benefit of the doubt for now.
If we're going to have a three-person runoff, I'd prefer it to include Bacon over LD, who really hasn't raised my eyebrows at all - but I'm not in a position to change that, so I'm going to stick with my Jimmy vote, for both the early stack and because these posts:
I'm not keen at all on things playing out with Viking voting for Bacon
seem to contradict each other. It just seems as good a first-round reasoning as any.
ellabelle, you said you thought we needed a third person in the runoff - Was there any particular reason you chose LD over the other five people with one vote?
Mike D, Sleepytime is currently 17 hours ahead of Pool Party HQ time - so depending on how locked in I am, I may request that you not close voting between 9am & 5pm BST in certain rounds. If I don't mention anything beforehand, then go right ahead. Just wanted to give you a heads up.
Sleepy, there really wasn't a specific reason for LD being chosen over any other person. We had the quarrel going on and beyond that everyone was laying low. Do you believe that presenting this runoff as a single package, tying in those directly associated to the argument, is more beneficial than trying to divert away from what could very well be two townies with personal issues blowing up at one another?
Sleepy, there really wasn't a specific reason for LD being chosen over any other person. We had the quarrel going on and beyond that everyone was laying low. Do you believe that presenting this runoff as a single package, tying in those directly associated to the argument, is more beneficial than trying to divert away from what could very well be two townies with personal issues blowing up at one another?
Wait... what quarrel would that be, Ella? LD only has one post so far, and it doesn't mention you in any way.
And no, I think a wider runoff is a good thing (within reason at least - not much point in a 5- or 6-person runoff) - that's not what I was getting at though. I just wanted to know what made you cast your vote for him when that same reasoning could just as easily apply to others.
I should have clarified there: not we as in LD and me, but the collective we that we're witnessing the Viking and Jimmy exchange. I don't believe LD on the runoff is set on stone, but I would like to hear some more from others before I change my end of the vote.
If you want Bacon in the runoff, that's fine with me, Sleepy. I just think you're reading a little too far into this "contradiction." Viking's initial vote could have been on anyone - and the point was that he created this whole mess between me and him by switching off his initial vote (who happened to be Bacon) instead of letting the round play out. Sleepy or anyone else - be my guest - put Bacon in the runoff. He's made like 2 posts so I really have no read on him at all.
I really don't see where tying up all connections to a single argument in the runoff is going to be particularly helpful right now, especially with yesterday's word of polarization being thrown around. Beyond being the early voter, Bacon really hasn't done much to warrant suspicion in my opinion.
Bacon actually was the one to call the debate "polarized" but I do not disagree with him. I think in general it is more helpful to have someone involved when we jump this far down a rabbit hole because the other person will tend to be ignored if they are not involved. Also, if the town determines that Jimmy and I are both townies, it helps to have someone else involved, since many times mafia are involved in instigating these spats. Beyond that, as I said in a previous post, all Bacon has done is vote for me. Just with Jimmy jumping all around yelling about stacking, I would prefer to keep Bacon close.
what could very well be two townies with personal issues blowing up at one another?
I will acknowledge that I do not like Jimmy at all, however, I have learned to separate personal issues from this game. Bacon and I are not fond of each other either, and in one of the early games I played, he and I got into it purely over personal reasons, both of us ended up in the runoff, and he was voted off as a townie. At the end of the game, I felt like an idiot. Thats why I have tried to disengage and actually ask Jimmy for reasons and talk it through with him. However, I have asked for help from other townies asking if my statements are colored because as I said, a bias exists.
If you have a different view point on this, please let me know. I don't think his statements add up, and I have laid out exactly why I think he is acting suspicious, and all of I have gotten is "Viking is spinning, and he is responsible for all of this!" The one time he actual went to check facts, he proved my point, and went back to his rhetoric. But as I said, I could be wrong and would appreciate other viewpoints.
If you want Bacon in the runoff, that's fine with me, Sleepy. I just think you're reading a little too far into this "contradiction." Viking's initial vote could have been on anyone - and the point was that he created this whole mess between me and him by switching off his initial vote (who happened to be Bacon) instead of letting the round play out. Sleepy or anyone else - be my guest - put Bacon in the runoff. He's made like 2 posts so I really have no read on him at all.
First, you stacked on me almost immediately. As I said before, you know I always as a rule change votes day 1. You even commented about how it could be used against me last game, and I told you it was a fair point. Therefore, you had to know I would change votes and most likely to you, so please stop with the BS about "Viking created this mess." This is in the same vein as " Viking is making up BS" when I demonstrated clearly why I said what I said. Thats why you had to edit once you actually checked. Add to that a third dodge by attacking Sleepy, who accurately quoted you in context with your comments and things really are not adding up.
How is it always someone else who caused this situation? Again, it comes back to you are either mafia or you have let your personal feelings interfere with the game, and as I explained above, thats a pretty crappy thing to do to the town.
And seriously man, you couldn't have quoted me more out of context. What's your angle here?
Jimmy >> Sleepy
Wait a second... the consensus was having you and Viking in the runoff plus a third... then you switch, taking Viking out of the runoff? Not sitting too well with me.
I don't want to be accused of doing the same for LD (even though it seems more want bacon in there) by switching my vote to Viking, so I'm staying where I am, unless no one else changes before the deadline. I think we need to have Viking in there. He plays aggressively which means he'll get people talking and we'll be able to get more out of the votes if he's in it.
Krissy, the fact that me and Viking are default in the runoff because we are the only 2 people speaking doesn't sit well with me (besides the point that I'm one of those 2 in the runoff). This game has been happening for multiple days now and we are only on page 2??? Where is everyone? The fact that everyone is being so quiet with the exception of myself, viking, and more recently sleepy and ella is concerning IMO. And it makes me wonder if having a Jimmy vs. Viking showdown is something that the mafia wants.
Beyond that, sleepy is taking a nice angle here by quoting me out of context and trying to make me look suspicious. Plus, Viking's inaccurate posts earlier aren't so suspicious to me, as he was probably basing his statement on instinct and then backing it up with "facts" later that he clearly didn't check into very carefully. I made a similar error when correcting my post that it was mafia 65 instead of 66 where I made the first post.
At this point, I feel like Viking is only hating on me because he admittedly doesn't like me. That's fine - but I haven't seen too much to think he's actually mafia. And sleepy quoting me out of context and trying to ride the wave against me is much more concerning IMO.
Mike, can we have an extension through the weekend? I think it would help, especially with a runoff change and the debate going on. I know Ody and Sleepy both will not check in until late tonight, and since Sleepy is the subject of some of the debate, he should have a chance to respond.
Krissy, the fact that me and Viking are default in the runoff because we are the only 2 people speaking doesn't sit well with me (besides the point that I'm one of those 2 in the runoff). This game has been happening for multiple days now and we are only on page 2??? Where is everyone? The fact that everyone is being so quiet with the exception of myself, viking, and more recently sleepy and ella is concerning IMO. And it makes me wonder if having a Jimmy vs. Viking showdown is something that the mafia wants.
Beyond that, sleepy is taking a nice angle here by quoting me out of context and trying to make me look suspicious. Plus, Viking's inaccurate posts earlier aren't so suspicious to me, as he was probably basing his statement on instinct and then backing it up with "facts" later that he clearly didn't check into very carefully. I made a similar error when correcting my post that it was mafia 65 instead of 66 where I made the first post.
At this point, I feel like Viking is only hating on me because he admittedly doesn't like me. That's fine - but I haven't seen too much to think he's actually mafia. And sleepy quoting me out of context and trying to ride the wave against me is much more concerning IMO.
Valid points.
Unfortunately, we don't have a lot to go off of Day 1, so I think those who tend to be the most vocal get the attention for the runoffs. Not necessarily a good strategy as historically townies talk more than mafia. With that in mind, maybe we should look at adding a couple quieter peeps into the mix. Here's the post count (if I miscounted, someone please correct me):
The way i kind of see thing right now the runoff should be both Jimmy and Viking or neither. Usually I am more inclined to wider runoffs day 1 but I honestly don't see LD or Bacon or sleepy or anyone else that would go up with the 2 of them in any real danger of being voted off. It would essentially just be another place for people to hide a vote to keep a clean voting record. Or we could switch it up completely. Take the proverbial shot in the dark approach. Just throw a couple ransoms in there. My main concern looking ahead is what happens if Viking and Jimmy both survive and one gets whacked. They have given the mafia a perfect frame scenario and a whack that will not give us much to go by and spin us in circles. So with that, as it stands my vote on Tejas is not doing much, should we lean towards the second option and look in other directions,
Hakuna >> Krissy
I have been he victim of a voting partner not moving their vote and making reason for it, which is the position LD is in now. It's not a good move, but it is a move. Also the post counts. For starters I really don't see much of a difference between 1 and 3. Also adding we should look at getting in more quiet players, That's really all I'm doing. I'm grasping at straws obviously I'm just trying to work with something. Should we switch routes completely I would probably be more inclined to look else where.
The way i kind of see thing right now the runoff should be both Jimmy and Viking or neither. Usually I am more inclined to wider runoffs day 1 but I honestly don't see LD or Bacon or sleepy or anyone else that would go up with the 2 of them in any real danger of being voted off. It would essentially just be another place for people to hide a vote to keep a clean voting record. Or we could switch it up completely. Take the proverbial shot in the dark approach. Just throw a couple ransoms in there. My main concern looking ahead is what happens if Viking and Jimmy both survive and one gets whacked. They have given the mafia a perfect frame scenario and a whack that will not give us much to go by and spin us in circles.
Why would you say either both Jimmy and Viking or neither? I mean, the best case would have been them both plus a third (and I have come around to people's reasoning on Bacon), but how would taking them both out be advantageous? If we were going to do anything other than having them both in the first runoff, to have one in todays (as numbers currently are, Jimmy, for instance) and then see how and if the whack connects and continue on, keeping the other (again, in the current configuration, Viking) in mind. This would avoid the scenario you are talking about. If Jimmy is killed and Viking is whacked then we will have to find a new crop of suspects, yes, but it would keep the mafia from pinning a whack on the other depending how it all plays out.
what could very well be two townies with personal issues blowing up at one another?
I will acknowledge that I do not like Jimmy at all, however, I have learned to separate personal issues from this game. Bacon and I are not fond of each other either, and in one of the early games I played, he and I got into it purely over personal reasons, both of us ended up in the runoff, and he was voted off as a townie. At the end of the game, I felt like an idiot. Thats why I have tried to disengage and actually ask Jimmy for reasons and talk it through with him. However, I have asked for help from other townies asking if my statements are colored because as I said, a bias exists.
If you have a different view point on this, please let me know. I don't think his statements add up, and I have laid out exactly why I think he is acting suspicious, and all of I have gotten is "Viking is spinning, and he is responsible for all of this!" The one time he actual went to check facts, he proved my point, and went back to his rhetoric. But as I said, I could be wrong and would appreciate other viewpoints.
One quick question: When you first asked Jimmy about his tendency to late stack on the first stacker and he pointed out that he votes early, he doesn't respond to your question does he? I have known him to be an early voter, but he makes frequent changes to his votes, and does usually land a stack on early stackers later on. I am trying to figure out if this is part of what doesn't add up to you, because that was something I felt wasn't a complete answer myself.
Also, Hakuna, you are obviously on the "neither" side of the Viking/Jimmy all or nothing runoff, right? Why vote for Krissy when you had the power to throw Viking back in the mix?
Ella >> LD >> Tejas
There. Now there are two. I am not going to put Viking in there, I don't feel he warrants it at this time other than to appease the masses that want the Viking and Jimmy combo. Krissy stated intent earlier, and if that's the direction we feel it should go then I'm sure she will do that, or someone else will. I am just not going to continue to clutter the runoff with those that aren't raising flags.
Sorry I've hijacked this page, I'm having more of a thought fragment day than concise posting one.
Why are you taking LD out? Since ody was my first vote I am changing to LD for now. I like having 3-4 in the first runoff.
For the record I don't think jimmy & Viking should be in the runoff together. They always argue like this at the beginning of the games and it is an easy mafia tactic to use that against them.
I prefer 3 over 4 person in ruoffs, and with Krissy posting intent I didn't want to run into a 4 way should someone else vote for him. I don't honestly believe at this time he even has any running in there, since all he has really done is answer the calls for Bacon to be in the runoff.
Seeing how all votes are in, I will not automatically extend all weekend. There have been some requests for the round not to end tonight. Round 1 is extended and is scheduled to close 8pm Saturday. If there is still lots of movement and/or requests we will extend as need be.
The way i kind of see thing right now the runoff should be both Jimmy and Viking or neither. Usually I am more inclined to wider runoffs day 1 but I honestly don't see LD or Bacon or sleepy or anyone else that would go up with the 2 of them in any real danger of being voted off. It would essentially just be another place for people to hide a vote to keep a clean voting record. Or we could switch it up completely. Take the proverbial shot in the dark approach. Just throw a couple ransoms in there. My main concern looking ahead is what happens if Viking and Jimmy both survive and one gets whacked. They have given the mafia a perfect frame scenario and a whack that will not give us much to go by and spin us in circles.
Why would you say either both Jimmy and Viking or neither? I mean, the best case would have been them both plus a third (and I have come around to people's reasoning on Bacon), but how would taking them both out be advantageous? If we were going to do anything other than having them both in the first runoff, to have one in todays (as numbers currently are, Jimmy, for instance) and then see how and if the whack connects and continue on, keeping the other (again, in the current configuration, Viking) in mind. This would avoid the scenario you are talking about. If Jimmy is killed and Viking is whacked then we will have to find a new crop of suspects, yes, but it would keep the mafia from pinning a whack on the other depending how it all plays out.
i say both or neither, bsically because i feel like if only 1 of them ends up in the runoff there is a good chance there will be some sort of mafia manipulation involved to get that specific person in for some reason and not the other. On top of that, i dont think either of them would get a totally fair shake against a seeminly random person just tossed in, i think the "runoff" would be more of a formality. You say the best case would be to have the 2 of them and a 3rd, so why? i explained why i dont think is, i'm not trying to be confrontational im just curious for your reasoning, and im not gonna buy a standard responce like wider runoffs are generally better, i mean in this specific example.
Also, Hakuna, you are obviously on the "neither" side of the Viking/Jimmy all or nothing runoff, right? Why vote for Krissy when you had the power to throw Viking back in the mix?
Ella >> LD >> Tejas
There. Now there are two. I am not going to put Viking in there, I don't feel he warrants it at this time other than to appease the masses that want the Viking and Jimmy combo. Krissy stated intent earlier, and if that's the direction we feel it should go then I'm sure she will do that, or someone else will. I am just not going to continue to clutter the runoff with those that aren't raising flags.
Sorry I've hijacked this page, I'm having more of a thought fragment day than concise posting one.
Not neccisarily no. if it came down to straight up Viking vs. Jimmy in a runoff chances are would vote for Jimmy. im not going to vote for viking just to get him in a runoff only to switch, the results of which would essentially be a 2 a vote swing(ex. 2-2 to 3-1) and could easily give way to a stack and give us no voting record to show. i have always been in the boat that like it or not, certain players are good day 1 targets. LD is one, Viking is one, MikeD is one, i have seen Bacon be one. i almost always give these players the benefit of the doubt. if we are going to vote off a townie day 1 it is better to have it be some who the mafia doesn't want dead.
