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I don't think anyone on this board does this. I think the majority of us would like Bonnaroo to live up to the standards it's set in the past. Every year we get less and less to be excited about. I would just like to see Bonnaroo not continue on this downward spiral. But hey that's probably an unrealistic expectation.
There are definitely some areas where I wish the festival would get back to its roots. I completely agree. Personally, however, Pearl Jam last year with LCD and U2 with Chance this year is about as good as it can get with me for realistic headliners.
I don't think the headliners this year or last year were an issue at all. It's pretty much everything else. But since we're in the superjam thread just look back at the superjams from 2012-2014 then 2015-2017...the drop off in effort and creativity is very apparent
Again, most of us are just looking to have Roo put out the great lineups they were known for putting out for years. Between the dip in attendance numbers and the apathy from the majority of users on a Bonnaroo-centric forum, it's clear the recent lineups haven't enticed people to attend.
I'm thinking I don't understand what the consensus people even want here.
Seems like a bunch of people want the old jam type roos, but DEFINITELY NOT WSP (people bring up the glory years of roo, where these dudes were billed over Ye), maybe more folksy/bluegrassy, better edm/no edm, some people want bigger headliners but also not people that are too into the pop side of things (unless you are the possibly first ever pop star, Macca), want better rap but getting JAZZED for Chance, me personally I'd love to see some of the metal acts the past got but I don't see anyone being like "remember the good old days of Opeth and Meshuggah" outside a few people, I keep hearing about the Nick Cave empty audience yet now its "THERE ARE BARELY NO CONFLICTS", whats the point of spending Nick Cave money if he's going to get a "my cousin Nicks band" sized audience?
I think if anyone in charge of booking a festival looked through this board they would probably just be like what do these people want...
I'm thinking I don't understand what the consensus people even want here.
Seems like a bunch of people want the old jam type roos, but DEFINITELY NOT WSP (people bring up the glory years of roo, where these dudes were billed over Ye), maybe more folksy/bluegrassy, better edm/no edm, some people want bigger headliners but also not people that are too into the pop side of things (unless you are the possibly first ever pop star, Macca), want better rap but getting JAZZED for Chance, me personally I'd love to see some of the metal acts the past got but I don't see anyone being like "remember the good old days of Opeth and Meshuggah" outside a few people, I keep hearing about the Nick Cave empty audience yet now its "THERE ARE BARELY NO CONFLICTS", whats the point of spending Nick Cave money if he's going to get a "my cousin Nicks band" sized audience?
I think if anyone in charge of booking a festival looked through this board they would probably just be like what do these people want...
It was pretty obvious what we wanted and they gave it to us pretty much every year until last year. Sales were way down last year and not so great this year either, despite having U2. It's not really that confusing.
2004 - The Dead, Dave Matthews, Trey Anastasio, Bob Dylan, David Byrne, Primus - 90,000 (Wiki) - First "DJ/Electronic act" is Cut Chemist line 8, no others I recognize, also ZERO hip hop (except for Cut Chemist ironically).
2014 - Elton John, Kanye West, Jack White, Lionel Richie, Vampire Weekend, Avett Brothers - 90,000 (Wiki) - Skrillex #8 overall, first Jam band is Umph, pretty low, and from what I hear also not at night.
Theses are wildly different tops, and it trickles down similarly. If you were STOKED for 2004, 2014 arguably didn't do much for you. Both brought in 90K. So maybe it wasn't 100% due to lineup, there are a lot of factors involved. But to think you got the same thing year in and year out is silly.
Highest selling Roo was 12' which also had RHCP as the 2.
I think there's a lot of "back in my day" out of contexting here.
Post by Delicious Meatball Sub on May 25, 2017 15:47:10 GMT -5
Wikipedia is wrong on those attendance numbers.
Highest recent attendance was 85k in 2011, 2015 sold 74k. I'm not sure how that relates to your overall point, cause I can't understand what the hell your point is, just correcting that bit of info.
Highest recent attendance was 85k in 2011, 2014 sold 74k. I'm not sure how that relates to your overall point, cause I can't understand what the hell your point is, just correcting that bit of info.
the point is that ticket sales were maintained despite a highly varied lineup.
If you were into jammy/folky roo in 04, i would expect a level of distaste towards Ye/Skrillex being so high, and that Roo hasn't had this sort of "board pleasing" lineup year to year because it has grown considerably in the kinds of acts they got.
Highest recent attendance was 85k in 2011, 2014 sold 74k. I'm not sure how that relates to your overall point, cause I can't understand what the hell your point is, just correcting that bit of info.
Yeah and they lowered attendance after that year since it was such a cluster. And the festival market, and the festival itself, were very different then so I don't see what your point is.
Yeah and they lowered attendance after that year since it was such a cluster. And the festival market, and the festival itself, were very different then so I don't see what your point is.
My point is that people are making this more out to be about quality of lineup, when in reality its a bunch of things.
Again, most of us are just looking to have Roo put out the great lineups they were known for putting out for years. Between the dip in attendance numbers and the apathy from the majority of users on a Bonnaroo-centric forum, it's clear the recent lineups haven't enticed people to attend.
I think if anyone in charge of booking a festival looked through this board they would probably just be like what do these people want...
I'll tell you what we want
longer set times
longer late nights
some variety in the lineup...which would include at least a couple legacy acts, some unique "gets" (like Atomic Bomb) or just some artists that aren't playing almost every other festival, artists that have been around for more than 5 years (most of the top line this year wasn't even around before 2010), and a couple metal bands would be cool
some late night options that aren't EDM and can actually take advantage of being "late night" to put on a unique show
a decent Thursday lineup
Some electronic music that isn't cheesy trap/dubstep
A stronger hip-hop lineup with rappers that can actually you know....rap
and less boring pop acts that people aren't going to travel to Tennessee in the middle of June to see.
Yeah and they lowered attendance after that year since it was such a cluster. And the festival market, and the festival itself, were very different then so I don't see what your point is.
My point is that people are making this more out to be about quality of lineup, when in reality its a bunch of things.
Yeah and they lowered attendance after that year since it was such a cluster. And the festival market, and the festival itself, were very different then so I don't see what your point is.
My point is that people are making this more out to be about quality of lineup, when in reality its a bunch of things.
Ticket sales dropped 30k between 2015 and 2016. That doesn't happen in one year if the quality of the product is consistent.
Bonnaroo apologists like to pretend the fest had some long, slow decline due to factors out of its control. But that's just not what happened. It was chugging along, selling lots of tickets, then LiveNation came in and restructured the lineups, and it stopped selling lots of tickets. That's it. That's all there is to it.
I think if anyone in charge of booking a festival looked through this board they would probably just be like what do these people want...
I'll tell you what we want
longer set times
longer late nights
some variety in the lineup...which would include at least a couple legacy acts, some unique "gets" (like Atomic Bomb) or just some artists that aren't playing almost every other festival, artists that have been around for more than 5 years (most of the top line this year wasn't even around before 2010), and a couple metal bands would be cool
some late night options that aren't EDM and can actually take advantage of being "late night" to put on a unique show
a decent Thursday lineup
Some electronic music that isn't cheesy trap/dubstep
A stronger hip-hop lineup with rappers that can actually you know....rap
and less boring pop acts that people aren't going to travel to Tennessee in the middle of June to see.
Pretty much nailed it. He just singled out a couple of acts from 2 years. That's not really a good way to judge anything. But look at the lineups from like 06-14 and tell me the last couple years are not drastically different from that. They totally changed the way they're booking and they're obviously going for a completely different audience.
some variety in the lineup...which would include at least a couple legacy acts, some unique "gets" (like Atomic Bomb) or just some artists that aren't playing almost every other festival, artists that have been around for more than 5 years (most of the top line this year wasn't even around before 2010), and a couple metal bands would be cool
some late night options that aren't EDM and can actually take advantage of being "late night" to put on a unique show
a decent Thursday lineup
Some electronic music that isn't cheesy trap/dubstep
A stronger hip-hop lineup with rappers that can actually you know....rap
and less boring pop acts that people aren't going to travel to Tennessee in the middle of June to see.
Pretty much nailed it. He just singled out a couple of acts from 2 years. That's not really a good way to judge anything. But look at the lineups from like 06-14 and tell me the last couple years are not drastically different from that. They totally changed the way they're booking and they're obviously going for a completely different audience.
If Nick Cave was scheduled at a better time he would have had a much bigger audience. He was up against the last half of Jack White, The Flaming Lips, Frank Ocean, and a huge superjam. Of course he had a small audience.
My point is that people are making this more out to be about quality of lineup, when in reality its a bunch of things.
Ticket sales dropped 30k between 2015 and 2016. That doesn't happen in one year if the quality of the product is consistent.
Bonnaroo apologists like to pretend the fest had some long, slow decline due to factors out of its control. But that's just not what happened. It was chugging along, selling lots of tickets, then LiveNation came in and restructured the lineups, and it stopped selling lots of tickets. That's it. That's all there is to it.
You know there are people whose job it is to do market research. They send out feedback forms to consumers, go over the responses, ect. They did that research after last year to see what the problem was.
You notice how all of the things you and others like to complain about were not addressed? That is because what you like to complain about, is not an issue anywhere but on this message board and in your head.
I think if anyone in charge of booking a festival looked through this board they would probably just be like what do these people want...
I'll tell you what we want
longer set times - i member tame getting said time and failing to execute, also not everyone is trying to play 3 hr sets, maybe that's more on the artist?
longer late nights - this is probably them, but you're still getting 5 extra hours, FIVE, than ACL (assuming all city fests are pretty similar, even DfN had to go indoors for their after midnight shows)
some variety in the lineup...which would include at least a couple legacy acts, some unique "gets" (like Atomic Bomb) or just some artists that aren't playing almost every other festival, artists that have been around for more than 5 years (most of the top line this year wasn't even around before 2010), and a couple metal bands would be cool - U2/RHCP have 65 yrs of being a band between them, I don't recall a bunch of other fests getting Kidjo's Remain in Light, Chance/Flume are the only post '10 in the top 6, no one else is getting U2, I also don't feel like Kiwanuka/Khruangbin/Klangstof are playing every fest under the sun, and yes I'm upset by the metal, I was also bummed at that last year.
some late night options that aren't EDM and can actually take advantage of being "late night" to put on a unique show - PTM (again sorry to keep picking on Tame but we got the same exact set as basically every other show theyve done last year)
a decent Thursday lineup - I personally really liked the Orwells before this was announced, Mondo, Goldfish, G Jones, Hippo, Twigs, Turkuaz, Welles is fine for Thursday, sure its not Glass Animals, but they're also a lot bigger now then they were 2 years ago.
Some electronic music that isn't cheesy trap/dubstep - Claude/Barc, Castles, Flume are not those things. Also we will for sure get to hear Jamie xx songs, while pitting U2.
A stronger hip-hop lineup with rappers that can actually you know....rap - yeah, i agree with this, but mainly because I think Chance is not supposed to be a top billed rapper. Flatbush is dank though, and they can rap.
and less boring pop acts that people aren't going to travel to Tennessee in the middle of June to see. - you mean just Lorde right? who else on this lineup is "pop"? Dua Lipa? No one's seeing her anyway likely.
Pretty much nailed it. He just singled out a couple of acts from 2 years. That's not really a good way to judge anything. But look at the lineups from like 06-14 and tell me the last couple years are not drastically different from that. They totally changed the way they're booking and they're obviously going for a completely different audience.
If Nick Cave was scheduled at a better time he would have had a much bigger audience. He was up against the last half of Jack White, The Flaming Lips, Frank Ocean, and a huge superjam. Of course he had a small audience.
If Nick Cave were playing this year no one would see him. He at least fit the complete randomness and unique type of acts they use to get. This year like 10 people would know who he is. It's a lineup for a different kind of crowd.
This is a pretty middling Superjam lineup (as announced), but compared to virtually everything else Bonnaroo is offering for late night, it looks like a diamond in a pile of turds
If Nick Cave was scheduled at a better time he would have had a much bigger audience. He was up against the last half of Jack White, The Flaming Lips, Frank Ocean, and a huge superjam. Of course he had a small audience.
If Nick Cave were playing this year now one would see him. He at least fit the complete randomness and unique type of acts they use to get. This year like 10 people would know who he is. It's a lineup for a different kind of crowd.
The crowd they have always gone after is college kids.
some variety in the lineup...which would include at least a couple legacy acts, some unique "gets" (like Atomic Bomb) or just some artists that aren't playing almost every other festival, artists that have been around for more than 5 years (most of the top line this year wasn't even around before 2010), and a couple metal bands would be cool
some late night options that aren't EDM and can actually take advantage of being "late night" to put on a unique show
a decent Thursday lineup
Some electronic music that isn't cheesy trap/dubstep
A stronger hip-hop lineup with rappers that can actually you know....rap
and less boring pop acts that people aren't going to travel to Tennessee in the middle of June to see.
Pretty much nailed it. He just singled out a couple of acts from 2 years. That's not really a good way to judge anything. But look at the lineups from like 06-14 and tell me the last couple years are not drastically different from that. They totally changed the way they're booking and they're obviously going for a completely different audience.
ok you're still picking the year when it went from Jam fest to Radiohead. How are you going to say I'm cherry picking when you are ignoring the fact they went from WSP/DMB in 05 to Radiohead/Tom Petty in 06. That's drastically different.
My point is that people are making this more out to be about quality of lineup, when in reality its a bunch of things.
Ticket sales dropped 30k between 2015 and 2016. That doesn't happen in one year if the quality of the product is consistent.
Bonnaroo apologists like to pretend the fest had some long, slow decline due to factors out of its control. But that's just not what happened. It was chugging along, selling lots of tickets, then LiveNation came in and restructured the lineups, and it stopped selling lots of tickets. That's it. That's all there is to it.
LN didnt take a Jam fest and have Billy Joel headline it.
I don't think anyone is arguing that Bonnaroo stayed the same all those years, just that it was good all those years. Now it's not good. The lineup sucks, set times are shorter, less late nights. Everyone here thinks it sucks and everyone in the general public thinks it sucks, thats why they can't even approach the same ticket sales they had before 2016.
Ticket sales dropped 30k between 2015 and 2016. That doesn't happen in one year if the quality of the product is consistent.
Bonnaroo apologists like to pretend the fest had some long, slow decline due to factors out of its control. But that's just not what happened. It was chugging along, selling lots of tickets, then LiveNation came in and restructured the lineups, and it stopped selling lots of tickets. That's it. That's all there is to it.
LN didnt take a Jam fest and have Billy Joel headline it.
What's your argument here? That because Billy Joel headlined in 2015, 30k fewer people bought tickets the next year?
I don't think anyone is arguing that Bonnaroo stayed the same all those years, just that it was good all those years. Now it's not good. The lineup sucks, set times are shorter, less late nights. Everyone here thinks it sucks and everyone in the general public thinks it sucks, thats why they can't even approach the same ticket sales they had before 2016.
Even Bonnaroo's biggest defender doesn't appear to be actually going.
