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Clearly the lack of rock music is why Weekend 2 didn’t sell well. Bumblebee and company were very clear about that and (somehow) this proves them right.
Precisely. Just look at how quickly they sold out only one day of Just Like Heaven at a much much smaller venue. Such incredible demand they’re missing out on here.
The argument isn't that there's so much demand for that music they could sell 125k tickets on it; it's more that they might sell an additional 10k. Like: the lineup this year may have only been strong enough to attract 115k people, and catering a bit more to rock with Just Like Heaven-type acts might have been able to move another 10k that aren't otherwise interested.
Post by donalddrumpf on Apr 2, 2019 15:09:18 GMT -5
For W2 to sell out easily they need to create a lineup that "Wows" you. People will still buy W1 regardless of lineup just b/c of the social media aspect. Also I think more tickets are given away for W1 to media and social media influencers, so this helps move some tickets.
You guys think lowering the price by $50-75 for W2 would even make the perception worse or would it help since a lot of people want to also save some money?
Post by WhyTheLongFace on Apr 2, 2019 15:14:54 GMT -5
There’s no one factor in tickets not selling as well Festival fatigue Losing 2 headliners Post-Beyonce Prices getting high while unique experiences and reunions getting lower GV cutting into their own market with festivals (Flog, JLH, Smokin Grooves, Smokers Fest, FYF, etc) More artists going on tour Some people feeling they only have to go once
I trust Coachella to last longer than all the competition even with this said. If they went back to one weekend resale would be $800+ now
The main issue with W2 is that to the general populace, there is a perception it is far less desirable, and while I love Coachella, the reason why this fest sells so well is the perceived exclusivity compared to other fests, so of course the "exclusive" weekend is going to have way more demand even if the value add is really only better grass. I've been to both many times and far prefer W2 for smoother logistics, but all the publicity is from W1 so the general perception is "W1 or bust". I've said this a trillion times on here, but vendors were told last year to prep for a wildly different number of attendees (think it was full capacity for W1 and 80K for W2) and that was a year with Beyonce at the helm of the ship. I can only imagine that disparity is greater this year.
When they announced they were streaming both weekends, it immediately seemed like a way to start to push both weekends as equally desirable events. I really would not be surprised at all to see some special sets (some headliners, for example) to be reserved for the W2 streaming to try to start to promote them as equally desirable weekends. And in theory it shouldn't be hard...one as the excitement of opening weekend, one as the grand finale. There's a great marketing angle for both, but up until this year due to lack of streaming, W1 gets all the press even if some artists (Dre, Kanye, NWA, Usher, etc) have saved their guest appearances for W2 in recent years. Because if you are an act that wants to use Coachella to bump up your stature, of course you save your most special guests and surprises for the weekend with streaming and publicists roaming the fields.
If Kanye is really only W2, then that should certainly help demand for next year.
You think it was a 45k difference between W1 and W2 last year? That seems pretty unlikely to me, though I was only there W1. A 20k difference is not unreasonable though, nor the end of the world.
Do attendees really care about streaming? To be honest, as a weekend 1 goer, I would love for Weekend 2 to start getting more streams. Then I could actually watch them.
For what it's worth, the primary reason I do Weekend 1 is resale value. Many of my friends are not sure whether they'll be able to go when presale happens, but they get tickets knowing they'll be able to get their money back. That would not be the case weekend 2. It creates a sort of self-fulfilling prophesy.
And if anyone buys tickets to Weekend 2 next year expecting a "one weekend only" act like Kanye again, they are in for some serious disappointment. This is obviously an exception, and we still don't know how it's going to be handled. They've been very clear about wanting both weekends to be the same. It would be a damn shame if they started handling two weekends the way ACL does.
Precisely. Just look at how quickly they sold out only one day of Just Like Heaven at a much much smaller venue. Such incredible demand they’re missing out on here.
The argument isn't that there's so much demand for that music they could sell 125k tickets on it; it's more that they might sell an additional 10k. Like: the lineup this year may have only been strong enough to attract 115k people, and catering a bit more to rock with Just Like Heaven-type acts might have been able to move another 10k that aren't otherwise interested.
I'd believe this if those kind of rock acts pulled decent crowds at Coachella these days. But they don't.
I like wk 1 better. Since I’ve been going weekend 2 has had much warmer weather. It also is fun having the surprise factor. That feeling of pure confusion walking up to Sufjan after having only listened to Carrie and Lowell and Illinois was amazing.
I mean this is still one of my favorite lineups of the year, but I don't think it's so far fetched to say that these weak top lines might have taken away from sells. The headliners and second lines are probably my least favorite in the festival's history. Get that this trend is happening everywhere else (for the most part) too though.
I think this could be true. Honestly the second lines this year are relatively weak in comparison (matter of opinion of course). Certainly less diverse. I think 2017 is a fair comparison, but 2017 had "bigger" names in my eyes.
The argument isn't that there's so much demand for that music they could sell 125k tickets on it; it's more that they might sell an additional 10k. Like: the lineup this year may have only been strong enough to attract 115k people, and catering a bit more to rock with Just Like Heaven-type acts might have been able to move another 10k that aren't otherwise interested.
I'd believe this if those kind of rock acts pulled decent crowds at Coachella these days. But they don't.
That's at least in part because they only half-assedly cater to those crowds. There needs to be name brand draws toward the top of the bill in order to draw a crowd that'll go to the rest of the acts. If your top 6 are The Weeknd, Beyonce, Eminem, SZA, HAIM, and ODESZA, it's hard to expect people who love The War On Drugs to show up. Whereas when AC/DC was a headliner, The War On Drugs drew a great crowd.
I'd believe this if those kind of rock acts pulled decent crowds at Coachella these days. But they don't.
That's at least in part because they only half-assedly cater to those crowds. There needs to be name brand draws toward the top of the bill in order to draw a crowd that'll go to the 4th-line and below acts. If your top 6 are The Weeknd, Beyonce, Eminem, SZA, HAIM, and ODESZA, it's hard to expect people who love The War On Drugs to show up. Whereas when AC/DC was a headliner, The War On Drugs drew a great crowd.
Guided By Voices couldn't draw more than half a Sonora when one of the headliners was Radiohead.
That's at least in part because they only half-assedly cater to those crowds. There needs to be name brand draws toward the top of the bill in order to draw a crowd that'll go to the 4th-line and below acts. If your top 6 are The Weeknd, Beyonce, Eminem, SZA, HAIM, and ODESZA, it's hard to expect people who love The War On Drugs to show up. Whereas when AC/DC was a headliner, The War On Drugs drew a great crowd.
Guided By Voices couldn't draw more than half a Sonora when one of the headliners was Radiohead.
The Sonora was also a brand new stage in the literal furthest possible place from the rest of the festival that year. There were a bunch of acts I wanted to see there but I didn't see any of them because it was such a waste of time to try to get to and back from. Plenty of other acts on other stages did fine.
Clearly the lack of rock music is why Weekend 2 didn’t sell well. Bumblebee and company were very clear about that and (somehow) this proves them right.
Precisely. Just look at how quickly they sold out only one day of Just Like Heaven at a much much smaller venue. Such incredible demand they’re missing out on here.
I also like the fact that a bunch of Just Like Heaven acts played Coachella in 2013 and it was a disaster.
Guided By Voices couldn't draw more than half a Sonora when one of the headliners was Radiohead.
The Sonora was also a brand new stage in the literal furthest possible place from the rest of the festival that year. There were a bunch of acts I wanted to see there but I didn't see any of them because it was such a waste of time to try to get to and back from. Plenty of other acts on other stages did fine.
I'm not sure your anecdotal laziness proves anything.
The Sonora was also a brand new stage in the literal furthest possible place from the rest of the festival that year. There were a bunch of acts I wanted to see there but I didn't see any of them because it was such a waste of time to try to get to and back from. Plenty of other acts on other stages did fine.
I'm not sure your anecdotal laziness proves anything.
Nothing here proves anything. But a big part of the appeal of Coachella to me, at least, is that I don't spend half the day walking and not listening to music. It's not laziness, it's that I'd have had to skip a not insignificant amount of other acts to get there and back. This is also a reason OSL sucks in comparison to Coachella.
Anyway, the *real* reason weekend 2 didn’t sell well is because they didn’t book any of my favorite obscure house djs.
What do you think is the reason why W2 is having problems? Genuinely curious?
I just think its getting too pricey now and if the lineup isn't insane then its not a "must go".
I think it’s a list of all the things people have suggested. Weekend 2 has always had significantly less demand, increased capacity for Weekend 1 has made that even more true. Most festivals appear to be having a down year, with the exception of maybe Bonnaroo which is still bouncing back from their own couple years in the wilderness. The headliners are objectively not as big as they had been planning on, and swapping them out probably had knock on effects on the rest of the poster. I joke about obscure house djs but that’s something I’m legit peeved about, and part of the reason I did presale was because I thought I could count on that genre being represented.
But I think the house music and the guitar acts is a pretty minor issue. The biggest issues are headliners that are a clear step down commercially from what people expect from Coachella, and just a general trend away from interest in big multi-genre festivals.
Post by Whereispassionpit on Apr 2, 2019 16:13:24 GMT -5
I feel like if there were actual concerns about W2 sales, they wouldn't have called it a sellout since January. It would have been pretty easy to, you know, keep selling ticket thought the normal website links.
Definitely the softest secondary market I can remember though
What do you think is the reason why W2 is having problems? Genuinely curious?
I just think its getting too pricey now and if the lineup isn't insane then its not a "must go".
I think it’s a list of all the things people have suggested. Weekend 2 has always had significantly less demand, increased capacity for Weekend 1 has made that even more true. Most festivals appear to be having a down year, with the exception of maybe Bonnaroo which is still bouncing back from their own couple years in the wilderness. The headliners are objectively not as big as they had been planning on, and swapping them out probably had knock on effects on the rest of the poster. I joke about obscure house djs but that’s something I’m legit peeved about, and part of the reason I did presale was because I thought I could count on that genre being represented.
But I think the house music and the guitar acts is a pretty minor issue. The biggest issues are headliners that are a clear step down commercially from what people expect from Coachella, and just a general trend away from interest in big multi-genre festivals.
Yep, it's pretty much these two things exactly. People interested in the indie/alternative or obscure electronic aspects of the festival are going to indie/alternative or obscure electronic festivals. People interested in the pop aspect or "because it's Coachella" aren't buzzing about Ariana's set, had two chances to see Gambino in the winter in LA, and barely know what a Tame Impala is. Living in LA, I've heard very little buzz about Coachella this year vs. Beyonce last year, Gaga/Kendrick/Beyonce in 2017, or GnR/LCD reunions in '16. The girl I sold my ticket to said she only knew Ariana Grande was playing and that's it.
It's not "OMG Coachella is CANCELLLEEDDD" but in the new era of fragmented musical lineups, they're going to have to continue bringing 1-2 major, major buzz headliners/reunions a year to push the amount of tickets they have.
What do you think is the reason why W2 is having problems? Genuinely curious?
I just think its getting too pricey now and if the lineup isn't insane then its not a "must go".
I think it’s a list of all the things people have suggested. Weekend 2 has always had significantly less demand, increased capacity for Weekend 1 has made that even more true. Most festivals appear to be having a down year, with the exception of maybe Bonnaroo which is still bouncing back from their own couple years in the wilderness. The headliners are objectively not as big as they had been planning on, and swapping them out probably had knock on effects on the rest of the poster. I joke about obscure house djs but that’s something I’m legit peeved about, and part of the reason I did presale was because I thought I could count on that genre being represented.
But I think the house music and the guitar acts is a pretty minor issue. The biggest issues are headliners that are a clear step down commercially from what people expect from Coachella, and just a general trend away from interest in big multi-genre festivals.
You think making W2 tickets at $350-$375 would kill W2 or help sales? That $50-75 may be a big plus for some
I agree on your points though and think it has to do with a lot of issues.
2 of the 3 headliners are still very popular/mainstream and Tame is a pretty popular rock band. But do you just mean like numbers wise compared to Kanye, Beyonce, Drake, ACDC, Guns N Roses?
But I am worried W1 will soon have these issues. Ticket prices will continue to rise and wow factor will likely continue to decline
I'm not sure your anecdotal laziness proves anything.
Nothing here proves anything. But a big part of the appeal of Coachella to me, at least, is that I don't spend half the day walking and not listening to music. It's not laziness, it's that I'd have had to skip a not insignificant amount of other acts to get there and back. This is also a reason OSL sucks in comparison to Coachella.
While this may be true to you this isn’t true for fans of other genres that pull well. People didn’t avoid Migos and Post cause it was soooo far. If you not wanting to walk can stop you (and hundreds to thousands) from seeing an act then that festival that is on acres of land will focus on acts paying customers will walk for.
Also maga Ye would have made the secondary market much higher. Even JT
Nothing here proves anything. But a big part of the appeal of Coachella to me, at least, is that I don't spend half the day walking and not listening to music. It's not laziness, it's that I'd have had to skip a not insignificant amount of other acts to get there and back. This is also a reason OSL sucks in comparison to Coachella.
While this may be true to you this isn’t true for fans of other genres that pull well. People didn’t avoid Migos and Post cause it was soooo far. If you not wanting to walk can stop you (and hundreds to thousands) from seeing an act then that festival that is on acres of land will focus on acts paying customers will walk for.
Also maga Ye would have made the secondary market much higher. Even JT
Not sure your point here. Obviously Migos and Post Malone will outdraw Guided By Voices anywhere at any time under any circumstances. But fans of Guided By Voices aren't hanging around the Sahara and Yuma all day. That band would have drawn much better if given a set in the Gobi, just like plenty of other bands of the ilk we're discussing drew fine outside the Sonora that year.
While this may be true to you this isn’t true for fans of other genres that pull well. People didn’t avoid Migos and Post cause it was soooo far. If you not wanting to walk can stop you (and hundreds to thousands) from seeing an act then that festival that is on acres of land will focus on acts paying customers will walk for.
Also maga Ye would have made the secondary market much higher. Even JT
Not sure your point here. Obviously Migos and Post Malone will outdraw Guided By Voices anywhere at any time under any circumstances. But fans of Guided By Voices aren't hanging around the Sahara and Yuma all day. That band would have drawn much better if given a set in the Gobi, just like plenty of other bands of the ilk we're discussing drew fine outside the Sonora that year.
I don’t think they would have drew better than 50 more people anywhere else in the expanded grounds. I believe they played the last year in the old footprint where the Sonora was in the front too, so they are pretty a bad example. They are just a small draw anywhere, anytime at Coachella.
Not sure your point here. Obviously Migos and Post Malone will outdraw Guided By Voices anywhere at any time under any circumstances. But fans of Guided By Voices aren't hanging around the Sahara and Yuma all day. That band would have drawn much better if given a set in the Gobi, just like plenty of other bands of the ilk we're discussing drew fine outside the Sonora that year.
I believe they played the last year in the old footprint where the Sonora was in the front too, so they are pretty a bad example.
If the suggestion here is that the Sonora being in the "front" was a good thing for drawing a crowd that year, I couldn't disagree more. My sense was that people glanced in on their way into the festival and didn't come back. By the time GBV went on, the Sonora was at the exit; most people were already well inside the fest, and nobody was leaving yet.
And sure they'd probably not be a great draw regardless, but similarly billed acts from Warpaint to Jagwar Ma to King Gizzard to Thundercat did fine, and I absolutely think each of those acts would've drawn less at the Sonora that year, and I absolutely think each of those acts would've drawn less if the top of the bill looked like last year instead of 2017.
I believe they played the last year in the old footprint where the Sonora was in the front too, so they are pretty a bad example.
If the suggestion here is that the Sonora being in the "front" was a good thing for drawing a crowd that year, I couldn't disagree more. My sense was that people glanced in on their way into the festival and didn't come back. By the time GBV went on, the Sonora was at the exit; most people were already well inside the fest, and nobody was leaving yet.
And sure they'd probably not be a great draw regardless, but similarly billed acts from Warpaint to Jagwar Ma to King Gizzard to Thundercat did fine, and I absolutely think each of those acts would've drawn less at the Sonora that year, and I absolutely think each of those acts would've drawn less if the top of the bill looked like last year instead of 2017.
Those acts are way more popular than GBV is right now.
If the suggestion here is that the Sonora being in the "front" was a good thing for drawing a crowd that year, I couldn't disagree more. My sense was that people glanced in on their way into the festival and didn't come back. By the time GBV went on, the Sonora was at the exit; most people were already well inside the fest, and nobody was leaving yet.
And sure they'd probably not be a great draw regardless, but similarly billed acts from Warpaint to Jagwar Ma to King Gizzard to Thundercat did fine, and I absolutely think each of those acts would've drawn less at the Sonora that year, and I absolutely think each of those acts would've drawn less if the top of the bill looked like last year instead of 2017.
Those acts are way more popular than GBV is right now.
Like way way more and could still draw decent in 2019
