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If the new album is a whiff, then she can easily do Mojave. Hell, she can easily do Mojave now.
And yeah she was way more popular in 2015. But she was also billed way lower. She got a big promotion despite rapidly declining popularity in the states. That's what's weird and what makes me think Paul may have some reason to suspect a big industry push behind the new album she announced.
Plus when I look at the second line this year there are definitely artists on it that I think WTF before I think of MARINA.
Who? I had a similar, "WTF really?" reaction to Daniel Caesar, Summer, Ari, Marina, and LTC, but then thought I may be woefully out of touch. FWIW Megan Thee Stallion landed exactly where I thought she would, and that seems (on Reddit at least) to be considered way overbilled so what do I know.
On the flip side, subs haven't look this big for awhile. A former headliner, a woman who was being batted around as a potential headliner, and an act (Flume) that nobody would have ever dared slot under a #2 on a mock. That's a big change from the past few years where many of the subs weren't playing all that large of venues and people were predicting them in the #4-#6 range.
Plus when I look at the second line this year there are definitely artists on it that I think WTF before I think of MARINA.
Who? I had a similar, "WTF really?" reaction to Daniel Caesar, Summer, Ari, Marina, and LTC, but then thought I may be woefully out of touch. FWIW Megan Thee Stallion landed exactly where I thought she would, and that seems (on Reddit at least) to be considered way overbilled so what do I know.
On the flip side, subs haven't look this big for awhile. A former headliner, a woman who was being batted around as a potential headliner, and an act (Flume) that nobody would have ever dared slot under a #2 on a mock. That's a big change from the past few years where many of the subs weren't playing all that large of venues and people were predicting them in the #4-#6 range.
You basically hit on everyone I was confused by. Megan the Stallion, Summer Walker and Ari especially just because they are all relatively newer artists. Same as you, I just may be out of touch on artists like this. I will add that all appear to put up decent streaming numbers, but I know Summer didn’t even come close to selling out her club show here in Phoenix, and Megan is nowhere close to Cardi. MARINA just seems like a Goldenvoice darling. She’s played multiple times and has moved up the lineup each time she’s played, so it’s not that shocking to see her on the second line when I would have expected her to be 3rd.
Outside of the subs, the entirety of the second lines are over billings imo. But the headliners and subs are all big, and the undercard is super deep. I remember last year looked weak on paper and then the consensus was that it was the best Coachella in a long time, after it was over.
I have a lot of acts on my list this year, but I have a top 16 where it'll be perfect if none of them conflict.
Who? I had a similar, "WTF really?" reaction to Daniel Caesar, Summer, Ari, Marina, and LTC, but then thought I may be woefully out of touch. FWIW Megan Thee Stallion landed exactly where I thought she would, and that seems (on Reddit at least) to be considered way overbilled so what do I know.
On the flip side, subs haven't look this big for awhile. A former headliner, a woman who was being batted around as a potential headliner, and an act (Flume) that nobody would have ever dared slot under a #2 on a mock. That's a big change from the past few years where many of the subs weren't playing all that large of venues and people were predicting them in the #4-#6 range.
You basically hit on everyone I was confused by. Megan the Stallion, Summer Walker and Ari especially just because they are all relatively newer artists. Same as you, I just may be out of touch on artists like this. I will add that all appear to put up decent streaming numbers, but I know Summer didn’t even come close to selling out her club show here in Phoenix, and Megan is nowhere close to Cardi. MARINA just seems like a Goldenvoice darling. She’s played multiple times and has moved up the lineup each time she’s played, so it’s not that shocking to see her on the second line when I would have expected her to be 3rd.
We'll have a better sense of how overbilled the 2nd line acts are once some of them start announcing tours. Seems like almost none of these acts have dates in SF around Coachella yet, which is pretty odd IMO. Given SF is the concert market I'm most familiar with, it's the easiest metric for me to use to judge billing.
Who? I had a similar, "WTF really?" reaction to Daniel Caesar, Summer, Ari, Marina, and LTC, but then thought I may be woefully out of touch. FWIW Megan Thee Stallion landed exactly where I thought she would, and that seems (on Reddit at least) to be considered way overbilled so what do I know.
On the flip side, subs haven't look this big for awhile. A former headliner, a woman who was being batted around as a potential headliner, and an act (Flume) that nobody would have ever dared slot under a #2 on a mock. That's a big change from the past few years where many of the subs weren't playing all that large of venues and people were predicting them in the #4-#6 range.
You basically hit on everyone I was confused by. Megan the Stallion, Summer Walker and Ari especially just because they are all relatively newer artists. Same as you, I just may be out of touch on artists like this. I will add that all appear to put up decent streaming numbers, but I know Summer didn’t even come close to selling out her club show here in Phoenix, and Megan is nowhere close to Cardi. MARINA just seems like a Goldenvoice darling. She’s played multiple times and has moved up the lineup each time she’s played, so it’s not that shocking to see her on the second line when I would have expected her to be 3rd.
I could be off here, but my guess is that having acts like Megan, Summer, Ari, and Marina on the 2nd line was to intentionally promote female acts that at practically any other festival would have been billed a line lower. We have acts like Brockhampton, Big Sean, Lil Nas X, Roddy Ricch, Swae Lee and arguably a couple others who would have probably been billed higher at other fests.
You basically hit on everyone I was confused by. Megan the Stallion, Summer Walker and Ari especially just because they are all relatively newer artists. Same as you, I just may be out of touch on artists like this. I will add that all appear to put up decent streaming numbers, but I know Summer didn’t even come close to selling out her club show here in Phoenix, and Megan is nowhere close to Cardi. MARINA just seems like a Goldenvoice darling. She’s played multiple times and has moved up the lineup each time she’s played, so it’s not that shocking to see her on the second line when I would have expected her to be 3rd.
I could be off here, but my guess is that having acts like Megan, Summer, Ari, and Marina on the 2nd line was to intentionally promote female acts that at practically any other festival would have been billed a line lower. We have acts like Brockhampton, Big Sean, Lil Nas X, Roddy Ricch, Swae Lee and arguably a couple others who would have probably been billed higher at other fests.
Definitely not disagreeing with your thought process.
I remember last year looked weak on paper and then the consensus was that it was the best Coachella in a long time, after it was over.
To be fair, at least for me, a huge reason last year was easily one of the best Coachellas ever had less to do with the quality of the acts (though obviously that is part of it) but had more to do with the map/layout changes. The new location of the Sonora was an absolute game changer. Since I rarely spend any time at the Sahara/Yuma/Do Lab anyway, it was so nice almost never having to walk more than 5 minutes to get from stage to stage (the Mojave is still sort of a trek, but somehow felt much less last year). Not to mention that they also moved the Gobi south the Sonora, so that now there is no sound-bleed from the Outdoor or Main. All that + having the Sahara/Yuma/Do Lab crowd sort of quarantined to that side of the field makes for generally much better crowds at every other stage the majority of the time.
I remember last year looked weak on paper and then the consensus was that it was the best Coachella in a long time, after it was over.
To be fair, at least for me, a huge reason last year was easily one of the best Coachellas ever had less to do with the quality of the acts (though obviously that is part of it) but had more to do with the map/layout changes. The new location of the Sonora was an absolute game changer. Since I rarely spend any time at the Sahara/Yuma/Do Lab anyway, it was so nice almost never having to walk more than 5 minutes to get from stage to stage. Not to mention that they also moved the Gobi south the Sonora, so that now there is no sound-bleed from the Outdoor or Main. All that + having the Sahara/Yuma/Do Lab crowd sort of quarantined to that side of the field makes for generally much better crowds at every other stage the majority of the time.
Agree 100%! The layout was perfect last year. It increased my enjoyment substantially.
Post by WhyTheLongFace on Feb 13, 2020 15:10:47 GMT -5
Last year was fun just cause it was fun. Not that the lineup will look better in retrospective. Headliners will always not look good but everyone who went enjoyed themselves. Wasn’t many bad performances
To be fair, at least for me, a huge reason last year was easily one of the best Coachellas ever had less to do with the quality of the acts (though obviously that is part of it) but had more to do with the map/layout changes. The new location of the Sonora was an absolute game changer. Since I rarely spend any time at the Sahara/Yuma/Do Lab anyway, it was so nice almost never having to walk more than 5 minutes to get from stage to stage. Not to mention that they also moved the Gobi south the Sonora, so that now there is no sound-bleed from the Outdoor or Main. All that + having the Sahara/Yuma/Do Lab crowd sort of quarantined to that side of the field makes for generally much better crowds at every other stage the majority of the time.
Agree 100%! The layout was perfect last year. It increased my enjoyment substantially.
I reeeeally hope they just keep it the exact same, in regards to the stage locations. My one change would be to bring back that bar that was outside the Mojave that one year. It was so damn nice being able to watch Mojave acts while drinking a beer.
Last year was fun just cause it was fun. Not that the lineup will look better in retrospective. Headliners will always not look good but everyone who went enjoyed themselves. Wasn’t many bad performances
I mean, every year is fun, but there seemed to be a collective feeling that last year was definitely one of the better ones. Which was extra weird since the majority of people, myself included, seemed to hate the 2019 lineup when it came out.
an act (Flume) that nobody would have ever dared slot under a #2 on a mock
I actually lost money betting on reddit that Flume wasn't going to be a sub. I'm still shocked that he's a #2 after that Lolla set, I just don't think his live show is good or interesting, and if he does the same thing it'd be a tremendously weak show compared to what usually goes on in the subheadliner slot.. IMO it's a complete shame that Disclosure is billed below him, though I recognize Flume wins on streaming/popularity.
EDIT: actually scratch that, I just checked the Spotify numbers (total streams on big songs, monthly listeners) and Disclosure is still winning there. I'd be so curious to learn why Flume > Disclosure in the billing decision making.
You basically hit on everyone I was confused by. Megan the Stallion, Summer Walker and Ari especially just because they are all relatively newer artists. Same as you, I just may be out of touch on artists like this. I will add that all appear to put up decent streaming numbers, but I know Summer didn’t even come close to selling out her club show here in Phoenix, and Megan is nowhere close to Cardi. MARINA just seems like a Goldenvoice darling. She’s played multiple times and has moved up the lineup each time she’s played, so it’s not that shocking to see her on the second line when I would have expected her to be 3rd.
We'll have a better sense of how overbilled the 2nd line acts are once some of them start announcing tours. Seems like almost none of these acts have dates in SF around Coachella yet, which is pretty odd IMO. Given SF is the concert market I'm most familiar with, it's the easiest metric for me to use to judge billing.
I'm in Phoenix, and some amount of the 2nd line acts have played here recently or have upcoming shows.
Rex Orange County: sold out 1,800 cap venue in January. Side note: Madeon also sold out the same venue in November and Brockhampton sold out 2 shows there last fall. Thom Yorke: Playing a 5,000 cap theater in April. They aren't selling tickets for the upper level, so I'm unsure of the actual capacity. Not sold out yet. Daniel Caesar: sold out 1,800 cap venue in August. Marina: Playing 1,800 cap venue in April. On sale tomorrow Louis the Child: Sold out a 4,500-5,000 cap pool party in August. Playing a 10,000 cap outdoor show in April. Not sold out. Ari Lennox: Opened for Lizzo at a 1,800 cap venue in October.
Can you give us some examples of second line acts that played last year and the venues they played? Those would be impossibly paltry second line venues for San Francisco (where I live), but don't know where those stand re: Phoenix.
Last year was fun just cause it was fun. Not that the lineup will look better in retrospective. Headliners will always not look good but everyone who went enjoyed themselves. Wasn’t many bad performances
I mean, every year is fun, but there seemed to be a collective feeling that last year was definitely one of the better ones. Which was extra weird since the majority of people, myself included, seemed to hate the 2019 lineup when it came out.
I think I’m agreeing with you. I also hated the lineup and didn’t get a ticket til late March for $250. I’m just saying if I looked at the lineup my opinion wouldn’t change. But oddly enough everyone had fun.
And yeah last year's lineup wasn't necessarily the most stunning of all time, it's just that literally every act brought it 100%. It was by far the best year of the nine I've been to. I didn't see any bad shows. The layout was perfect, I agree, they shouldn't fuck with it.. But for me, there was just something about the crowd last year. The nicest people everywhere I met, and a lot of things I hadn't seen at Coachella in awhile...like the audience would start clapping to the beat together spontaneously when usually the artist leads it, at one point Let's Eat Grandma looked visibly shocked everybody was so into it. The women in Perfume almost started crying when they were complimenting the crowd. Dance parties were actually dance parties, not "let's be on our phones taking pictures" parties. There was just something intangible in the air that went beyond the lineup and layout. My only thought was that maybe the hype bubble had popped and less people that weren't into music were in attendance? There were no depressingly empty sets that I went to, even Sonora was full for every band I saw there. Seemed like I had a lot of conversations where people were talking about how they came for really small names and not just "I'm not into music but I like Migos" conversations. Met a girl from Berlin who literally flew out to see Ame.
No idea what happened last year, it was just wayyyy more awesome than it should have been given that it was kind of a "ehh middle of the road" lineup for me personally.
And yeah last year's lineup wasn't necessarily the most stunning of all time, it's just that literally every act brought it 100%. It was by far the best year of the nine I've been to. I didn't see any bad shows. The layout was perfect, I agree, they shouldn't fuck with it.. But for me, there was just something about the crowd last year. The nicest people everywhere I met, and a lot of things I hadn't seen at Coachella in awhile...like the audience would start clapping to the beat together spontaneously when usually the artist leads it, at one point Let's Eat Grandma looked visibly shocked everybody was so into it. The women in Perfume almost started crying when they were complimenting the crowd. Dance parties were actually dance parties, not "let's be on our phones taking pictures" parties. There was just something intangible in the air that went beyond the lineup and layout. My only thought was that maybe the hype bubble had popped and less people that weren't into music were in attendance? There were no depressingly empty sets that I went to, even Sonora was full for every band I saw there. Seemed like I had a lot of conversations where people were talking about how they came for really small names and not just "I'm not into music but I like Migos" conversations. Met a girl from Berlin who literally flew out to see Ame.
No idea what happened last year, it was just wayyyy more awesome than it should have been given that it was kind of a "ehh middle of the road" lineup for me personally.
Maybe it was the fact that 2018 had the worst crowds I’ve ever seen which made 2019 feel even more amazing.
Maybe it was the fact that 2018 had the worst crowds I’ve ever seen which made 2019 feel even more amazing.
LOL this too. 2018 was easily my least favorite Coachella (except 2014 but my wife stepped through a nail and we spent the whole day in the ER, so that's not Coachella's fault), despite loving the lineup. That crowd was catastrophically bad. The only year I actually felt the crowd was bad at Coachella.
Can you give us some examples of second line acts that played last year and the venues they played? Those would be impossibly paltry second line venues for San Francisco (where I live), but don't know where those stand re: Phoenix.
20,000 cap pavilion: Weezer (summer 2018) 18,000 cap arena: J Balvin (fall 2019), Khalid, Bad Bunny 5,000 cap theater: The 1975 (sold out), J Balvin (fall 2018) 4,500-5,000 cap pool party: Dillon Francis 1,800 cap club: Rufus du Sol (sold out), Billie Eilish (fall 2018-sold out), Chvrches (sold out)
I mean, every year is fun, but there seemed to be a collective feeling that last year was definitely one of the better ones. Which was extra weird since the majority of people, myself included, seemed to hate the 2019 lineup when it came out.
I think I’m agreeing with you. I also hated the lineup and didn’t get a ticket til late March for $250. I’m just saying if I looked at the lineup my opinion wouldn’t change. But oddly enough everyone had fun.
Oh my bad. I have a bad habit lately of totally misinterpreting peoples' comments.
I totally agree, the layout change enhanced the experience by a TON. But also the quality of performances were great overall.. had the most fun at sets that I wasn't anticipating, or acts I didn't know existed before the line up drop. It had less to do with WHO was playing and more of just enjoying a good time and having those moments. The crowds were also really good compared to the past few years. I feel having less huge acts like a Beyonce helps in that regard.
an act (Flume) that nobody would have ever dared slot under a #2 on a mock
I actually lost money betting on reddit that Flume wasn't going to be a sub. I'm still shocked that he's a #2 after that Lolla set, I just don't think his live show is good or interesting, and if he does the same thing it'd be a tremendously weak show compared to what usually goes on in the subheadliner slot.. IMO it's a complete shame that Disclosure is billed below him, though I recognize Flume wins on streaming/popularity.
EDIT: actually scratch that, I just checked the Spotify numbers (total streams on big songs, monthly listeners) and Disclosure is still winning there. I'd be so curious to learn why Flume > Disclosure in the billing decision making.
Disclosure has those songs with Khalid that boost his streaming numbers. And most people probably view them as a Khalid song. At least in NA I'd say Flume is a bigger draw.
With how poor ticket sales appear to be, I’m hoping this year has a very similar vibe.
I really think a lot of the hype around Coachella has finally died down, leading to overall better crowds.
They moved over to selling 125K/weekend in 2017 right? Seems like they haven't quite been able to hit that mark in sales without Beyonce on the tag. Both years that they sold out on 250K worth of tickets were years that Beyonce was on the bill when the lineup releases in January. So I don't know if its so much that the hype is dying down, more so that 250K might be a reach even for a behemoth like Coachella.
With how poor ticket sales appear to be, I’m hoping this year has a very similar vibe.
I really think a lot of the hype around Coachella has finally died down, leading to overall better crowds.
They moved over to selling 125K/weekend in 2017 right? Seems like they haven't quite been able to hit that mark in sales without Beyonce on the tag. Both years that they sold out on 250K worth of tickets were years that Beyonce was on the bill when the lineup releases in January. So I don't know if its so much that the hype is dying down, more so that 250K might be a reach even for a behemoth like Coachella.
Wasn't 2018 weekend 2 not actually a sell out? I seem to remember the vendors being told to expect like 80k or 90k people. Don't remember the exact figure.
