Whether it's your first Bonnaroo or you’re a music festival veteran, we welcome you to Inforoo.
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I think it's cool the biggest rapper in the world made a pro-transgender song in 2022 when people like Dave Chapelle are still making millions of bashing trans people.
thats a great point and is very true. its nice for trans issues to be acknowledged at all on a mainstream rap album i just think it could have been done in a better way. also i have no idea what any of your orientations are but if you are straight or cis, you don’t get a say as to whats done right or wrong on that track. not a dig towards you Tristan, i’m just seeing a lot of people on twitter/ whatnot telling lgbtq people what to think of the song and that shit bothers me
The rest of the record is fantastic, just need to sit with Auntie Diaries more to garner an opinion on it
it's definitely shocking and will probably have people feeling very strongly on many sides. don't really think anyone can tell anyone else how to feel about the song, but I'm just saying how it worked for me personally. I'm not straight but I am cis, but I also don't think every LGBT person is gonna view it the same way anyway, which is fine.
One of the things I’ve been reading about the album is that it’s about not tap dancing around issues, in particular issues in the Black community. I think that’s what the “big steppers” part is hinting at
Initial thoughts on first listen: It's easily his heaviest album. SUPER personal and I appreciate that. I personally relate to a lot of it. There's a ton of great music in here. That being said, it's definitely not what I would call a cohesive album. I'm going to give it more time to sit and re-listen multiple times.
Things I loved: . The way he utilized Kodak Black . The influence of Baby Keem all over this album, I haven't checked writer credits but a ton of these melodies sound like Baby Keem melodies (which is his . strongest trait in my opinion) . The features in general, I thought they all brought it and enhanced the listening experience. Ghost Face? Keem? Amanda Reifer? Taylour Paige? Fantastic . Again, the vulnerability and most of the concepts he brought. Especially United Grief and We Cry Together . Kendrick is probably the great story telling rapper of all time
Favorite Tracks (so far, not in order): United Grief, N95, Worldwide Steppers, We Cry Together, Father Time, Silent Hill, Savior, Mr. Morale
Things I didn't like (at least for now): . Totally a personal preference, but the album drags a bit in the second half for me. But lately I've had trouble with really long albums for some reason, that didn't used to be the case. . Again, the album doesn't feel cohesive to me. I might change my mind later, but I'm not sure how much replay value the album as a whole has for me. Wonder if I'll just pick out my favorite songs and have them on rotation instead.
. About Auntie Diaries.. yeah I appreciate the concept of the song. It's needed. BUT I'm not going to give a pass on the F word usage at all. I would be pretty upset if a white artist used the N word like that. Regardless of the context of the song, regardless if the overall theme of the song is positive. You don't have to actually say the word to get the point across. In one line he says "F bomb" instead of the actual word and I'm like "ok.. I think he's trying to show the growth from saying the word to not saying the word" but then he says the word again so like?? Outside of that it's a great song, amazing story telling, but it's always going to stick out like a sore thumb and takes away any replay value for me.
Sidenote: Did you all hear many songs with potential to be singles? Die Hard and Purple Hearts were the only two that stuck out to me
agreed. as a trans person like i get his point but it kind of soured the record for me. you don’t get to say faggot if you arent lgbt idc what context its in. its well intentioned but just missed the mark, like i think he almost gets it but isnt quite there. my feelings on it are very much mixed but maybe they’ll eventually change
Mirror definitely changed my feelings on Auntie Diaries. I don't see how you have those two songs on the same record and think they're diametrically opposed to one another. Kendrick is too smart to make an anti-trans song and have these lines three songs later. How they're not back to back on the track listing is beyond me.
The pressure's taking over me, it's beginning to loom Better if I spare your feelings and tell you the truth Lately, I redirected my point of view You won't grow waitin' on me I can't live in the Matrix, huh Rather for sure than your graces, huh This time I won't trade places, huh Not about who's right, who's wrong, huh Evolve, the only thing known, huh Ask me when I'm coming home, huh Blink twice again, I'm gone
I choose me, I'm sorry I choose me, I'm sorry I choose me, I'm sorry I choose me, I'm sorry I choose me, I'm sorry I choose me, I'm sorry
But it also got me thinking about language and how we use it. Specifically two things: Lenny Bruce and semantic satiation.
So Lenny Bruce has that famous bit where he drops the n-word 24 times. It *ends* with "til [it] didn't mean anything anymore, then you could never make some six-year-old black kid cry because somebody called him [it] at school."
Should Lenny Bruce have used the n-word 24 fuckin times in a single bit? No! But the bit is far less effective without it. The bit happened at a very specific point in time and was directed at a very specific audience. As queer people, I don't think we're the audience Auntie Diaries is directed at.
It uses the concept of semantic satiation: repetition of a word causes it to lose meaning and become this meaningless sound. That feeling you get when you think about a word too often and go "is that really a word?" is semantic satiation.
Taika Waititi uses it to great effect in Jojo Rabbit's best scene.
I wish I had Mirror six months ago. Hell, going through family therapy now, it'll be a useful shorthand. I've always prioritized others' emotional well-being over my own because it keeps me alive. I can't do that anymore.
(Whaddya know, trans people aren't a monolith. Good to know I'm not the only one on the board though, genuinely. No hate to you, and your opinion is perfectly valid.)
agreed. as a trans person like i get his point but it kind of soured the record for me. you don’t get to say faggot if you arent lgbt idc what context its in. its well intentioned but just missed the mark, like i think he almost gets it but isnt quite there. my feelings on it are very much mixed but maybe they’ll eventually change
Mirror definitely changed my feelings on Auntie Diaries. I don't see how you have those two songs on the same record and think they're diametrically opposed to one another. Kendrick is too smart to make an anti-trans song and have these lines three songs later. How they're not back to back on the track listing is beyond me. But it also got me thinking about language and how we use it. Specifically two things: Lenny Bruce and semantic satiation.
So Lenny Bruce has that famous bit where he drops the n-word 24 times. It *ends* with "til [it] didn't mean anything anymore, then you could never make some six-year-old black kid cry because somebody called him [it] at school."
Should Lenny Bruce have used the n-word 24 fuckin times in a single bit? No! But the bit is far less effective without it. The bit happened at a very specific point in time and was directed at a very specific audience. As queer people, I don't think we're the audience Auntie Diaries is directed at.
It uses the concept of semantic satiation: repetition of a word causes it to lose meaning and become this meaningless sound. That feeling you get when you think about a word too often and go "is that really a word?" is semantic satiation.
Revisited the song. On first listen, the last line kind of lost me. "[F word x3] we can say it together, but only if we let a white girl say [N word]". At first I was thinking, is he implying we should let white people say it to erase it's meaning?
But actually I don't think that's what he's trying to say. I do think this line is def directed at us (Black community). I think he's basically telling our community, (who unfortunately is known to use homophobic slurs but that's a whole deep dive into where it stems from), that if you don't like other races saying words that offend us, don't say words to other communities that offend them. And to generally cut out the homophobia and transphobia, again because we don't like it when others treat us as lesser than. Reminds me of an old Lupe line "make a fuss if it's them, but we hush if it's us" which can be applied to all people and situations
I do see that if he hadn't used the F word, it wouldn't have had as much impact in the end. I appreciate that he's not afraid to dive into the hard but necessary conversations.
I can't speak for the Trans community, even understanding that Kendrick had good intentions, but it's totally valid if anyone is still offended by the word usage. I just hope the song does more good than harm. Hopefully no one tries to invalidate anyone who is offended.
Post by raftwithtaft on May 13, 2022 5:33:56 GMT -5
I think that the album as a whole is thematically about that kind of nuance, ambiguity, and perspective. He specifically laid out that concept for Mr. Morale in Heart Part 5 and the earlier leaked song Prayer points to it as well. There is a lot to unpack in the album about how we interact with the cultural/spiritual norms of our present and the people around us. How those interactions are influenced by the environment we navigate, what we experience, and the perspective we form from it.
But that also we can try to transcend that environment - and the vicious cycles that result - by speaking our truths to one another and rejecting insincerity in its many forms. For some additional layering of the concept, it seems like the album is also partially framed as a therapy session for himself through some of the intros. Setting his soul free from the curses he was pondering in DAMN.
Kendrick spends a lot of the album laying out these personal truths in a variety of ways. Dealing with daddy problems and trauma as a man, trying to understand the trauma of the women and family members in his life, his nuanced relationship with institutionalized religion vs. his spirituality, relationships and parenthood, worshiping flawed idols, masking personal faults with wealth, resisting some cyclical temptations like drugs but falling victim to others like LUST, living apart from the insincerity of phones and social media...
Just to name a few because he is all over the place. Providing the admission several times throughout the album that his perspective may come off as offensive, but that tapdancing (another motif that gets sprinkled in with restraint) around the conversations isn't going to bring any kind of collective truth. He can't please everybody. Truth resides in the fire.
It's honestly impressive to me that he can fit so many ideas into such a cohesive package with production that builds upon - and often transcends - a lot of what came before it in popular rap. Elements of production from stuff like Baby Keem, Earl Sweatshirt, 2008-2016 Kanye, and even stuff that sounds like it could have come out of Nils Frahm. J.LBS and Sounwave are all over the production credits, so just a great job by mostly in-house TDE talent bringing the concept together and working around the other producers. It's a fitting end to his run with TDE and feels to me like the final evolution of GKMC's conceptual design.
And that ends my shitty, half-baked Inforoo review.
I appreciate the ultimately pro-trans message of Auntie Diaries but I think it's just done very clunkily. Couldn't help but compare/contrast it with Frank Turner's "Miranda", a song that also has an ultimately pro-trans message but that gets there in an awkward way. But they're also pretty different in that Frank has done a lot of press about how "Miranda" is a true story and it's ambiguous if "Auntie Diaries" is actually based on anyone Kendrick knows. Didn't like it but don't really care if others do. also should say I'm not "offended" or whatever by Kendrick's use of That Word, but he definitely shouldn't have used it lol.
Ugh these beats just don't do it for me at all. My issue with Kendrick has never been his rapping which is superb, but his production. Just not my preference. Clearly in the minority here, and that's fine, but disappointed overall.
Post by Jake Jortles on May 13, 2022 9:20:52 GMT -5
After three listens, I feel pretty similar to how I feel about TPAB and Kendrick in general. The album is extremely impressive. It's unmistakably high effort. The world is better for it existing and my 2005 self is so happy that someone that makes this content is actually mainstream and a lot of people like it. My favorites so far are United in Grief, We Cry Together, Count Me Out, Auntie Diaries, and Mirror.
This album (and TPAB) feels like a spectacle of art that will remain somewhere tucked away in my mind in a museum for "impressive" things. But I'll be extremely surprised if I'm listening to it in a month. It's so weird because it feels like these albums are like The Wire of music and The Wire is my favorite show and I've watched it 4 times, but I just don't find myself turning to music for intellectual challenge / stimulation very often. Alongside that, I'm sticking with the take that Kendrick has the least amount of "rap-along-ability" of any all time great rapper. There's nothing sticky or exciting about his flows, delivery or lyricism that gives me the guttural urge to rap along with him in the car like I do for all of my favorites.
I'll end it on saying again that this album is an extremely impressive achievement. I proooobably would have shaved Die Hard, Rich Spirit, Purple Hearts, Silent Hill and the interludes but maybe they will grow on me.
It's so weird because it feels like these albums are like The Wire of music
Kendrick is 300% "The Wire" of music.
I have several songs I still listen to from TPAB pretty frequently. I know "DAMN" was a way to prove he can do a straight-forward hip-hop album, but I find myself listening to that one less than I do TPAB or m.a.a.d. city. I love the layers.
I appreciate the ultimately pro-trans message of Auntie Diaries but I think it's just done very clunkily. Couldn't help but compare/contrast it with Frank Turner's "Miranda", a song that also has an ultimately pro-trans message but that gets there in an awkward way. But they're also pretty different in that Frank has done a lot of press about how "Miranda" is a true story and it's ambiguous if "Auntie Diaries" is actually based on anyone Kendrick knows. Didn't like it but don't really care if others do. also should say I'm not "offended" or whatever by Kendrick's use of That Word, but he definitely shouldn't have used it lol.
I will say I feel similarly about "We Cry Together" which does work talking about domestic violence, and prevalence of these negative interactions in relationships in my community. It's clunky but it still is a necessary attempt to talk about a very polarizing group of topics.
Ugh these beats just don't do it for me at all. My issue with Kendrick has never been his rapping which is superb, but his production. Just not my preference. Clearly in the minority here, and that's fine, but disappointed overall.
just curious, how do you feel the production is disappointing on this?
Ugh these beats just don't do it for me at all. My issue with Kendrick has never been his rapping which is superb, but his production. Just not my preference. Clearly in the minority here, and that's fine, but disappointed overall.
just curious, how do you feel the production is disappointing on this?
I will say that this album is much more a sound art piece than your beat related bangers. He wants to do a large prose album and it's value is definite - but I understand when there's not a real radio single on the record.
Ugh these beats just don't do it for me at all. My issue with Kendrick has never been his rapping which is superb, but his production. Just not my preference. Clearly in the minority here, and that's fine, but disappointed overall.
just curious, how do you feel the production is disappointing on this?
Just speaking for my preference, I don't really like the kind of beats like United in Grief, Die Hard, Purple Hearts, Crown, ect. The laid back, jazz-style stuff isn't my jam. Like more of the DNA, Madd City, Ronald Reagan Era type stuff. I appreciate his vison and attempt to make an album that was something unique but at the end of the day, if I can't sit and enjoy it sonically, then the message/concept doesn't hit as hard.
just curious, how do you feel the production is disappointing on this?
I will say that this album is much more a sound art piece than your beat related bangers. He wants to do a large prose album and it's value is definite - but I understand when there's not a real radio single on the record.
That's why I'm completely obsessed. He proved he can make radio hits if he wants to, but he'd rather make this. King.
More digestible than TPAB on first listen. Honestly it's hard to compare his albums because they are all so different. I would probably rank Damn the lowest, not sure how this will fit in but loving it so far.
just curious, how do you feel the production is disappointing on this?
Just speaking for my preference, I don't really like the kind of beats like United in Grief, Die Hard, Purple Hearts, Crown, ect. The laid back, jazz-style stuff isn't my jam. Like more of the DNA, Madd City, Ronald Reagan Era type stuff. I appreciate his vison and attempt to make an album that was something unique but at the end of the day, if I can't sit and enjoy it sonically, then the message/concept doesn't hit as hard.
Different strokes but I'm in love with the production on this one. Most enjoyable, production wise, since TPAB for me. Everything just flows so smooth.
I appreciate the ultimately pro-trans message of Auntie Diaries but I think it's just done very clunkily. Couldn't help but compare/contrast it with Frank Turner's "Miranda", a song that also has an ultimately pro-trans message but that gets there in an awkward way. But they're also pretty different in that Frank has done a lot of press about how "Miranda" is a true story and it's ambiguous if "Auntie Diaries" is actually based on anyone Kendrick knows. Didn't like it but don't really care if others do. also should say I'm not "offended" or whatever by Kendrick's use of That Word, but he definitely shouldn't have used it lol.
I will say I feel similarly about "We Cry Together" which does work talking about domestic violence, and prevalence of these negative interactions in relationships in my community. It's clunky but it still is a necessary attempt to talk about a very polarizing group of topics.
I actually don't feel like We Cry Together is about domestic violence at all. It just feels and sounds like a very realistic heated argument where each side is projecting their insecurities, fears, trauma in the form of anger. It's an unhealthy way of venting. Instead of sitting down and talking it out, they get into a passionate shouting match to get their raw emotions out. Once they're done doing that, they finally come down from it and get intimate to cap off the emotional session they just had. It's unhealthy but it is their way of venting. It coincides with United Grief's theme of "I grieve different" where he talks about the various ways that Black culture expresses grief.
I will say I feel similarly about "We Cry Together" which does work talking about domestic violence, and prevalence of these negative interactions in relationships in my community. It's clunky but it still is a necessary attempt to talk about a very polarizing group of topics.
I actually don't feel like We Cry Together is about domestic violence at all. It just feels and sounds like a very realistic heated argument where each side is projecting their insecurities, fears, trauma in the form of anger. It's an unhealthy way of venting. Instead of sitting down and talking it out, they get into a passionate shouting match to get their raw emotions out. Once they're done doing that, they finally come down from it and get intimate to cap off the emotional session they just had. It's unhealthy but it is their way of venting. It coincides with United Grief's theme of "I grieve different" where he talks about the various ways that Black culture expresses grief.
Well what I mean is that the verbal abuse is potable on that track. It is the line that crosses between domestic disputes, and the way that it is created is made to highlight the way black families often fight. May it be over personified in media or if this is part of our cultural reality.