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Post by blazeaway54 on Apr 13, 2007 15:45:53 GMT -5
Alright, I want to see if anyone is as interested in this top as I am so here goes nothing. I was watching the Rolling Stones documentary the other night called Gimme Shelter. I'm not sure who if anyone is familiar with it but info can be found here: imdb.com/title/tt0065780/
Either way, as I was watching it I couldn't think of anything but the idea that this was really a perfect picture of the 60s, even more so than say Woodstock (the movie). We've got thousands about thousands of people out to have a good time and enjoy themselves while serious matters are going on (including a murder) and everyone just goes about their business. Keith Richards' idea of helping out is to say "Keep cool everyone" a few times. I think that image is a pretty perfect picture of the ignorance, idealism and egocentrism of the time period. Don't get me wrong, I'm fascinated by the times and all of the extremely positive things that came out of it but I feel like the whole hippie movement was doomed from the start and this is a pretty direct and frightening example. Do you guys think there was any success of the idea or that it didn't accomplish anything? Things like that, I'm just interested to hear what everyone thinks or knows, I love this stuff.
edit: Also, I can see everyone looking at my name as a drug reference, the acid tab as my avatar, and what have you and getting some interesting ideas. For the record, though, the name comes from an old Decemberists song that I used to love beyond belief (the name stuck through the ages) and the tab can be more easily explained by this article: erowid.org/culture/references/other/2004_drug_geeks_erowid.shtml
which I also think is interesting and you guys can discuss that if the 60s thing is boring.
Post by roolacksreality on Apr 14, 2007 8:58:32 GMT -5
Karma for you, blaze. I'm going to school next year to do a History major and I love this stuff. My favorite decades in American history were the 20s, 50s, and 60s. I love how the quiet conformity of the 50s really set up everything in the 60s. Plus, the 20s are cool because it set up the trends that many of today's youth still follow (IE illicit drinking, revealing clothing, etc.). As for 'Gimmie Shelter', I watched that documentry a year ago. I think what people forget to comprehend when they watch it that everything was at its peak in 1968, so there was no place to go but downhill. When I say everything, I mean Leary, Kesey, and Alpert continuing to praise LSD, and getting busted for it, the downfall of Haight Ashbury (IE the change from loving youths to burnt-out runaway drug users), the political turmoil of the year (Assassination of Bobby K. and MLK), and to top it off the rise off the hell's angels group (Which actually continued growing, but anyways...). All these factors set up doom for the festival. People were trying to continue an era of peace and love, but all the peace and love didn't really exist anymore. When you add in the grazing cows, drunk angels, and overall bad vibe of the festival, it's no wonder why it ended up like it did. The festival itself showed the dark side of the decade, and without-a-doubt was the beginning of the end for the flower era.
Post by poopzilla33 on Apr 14, 2007 14:10:45 GMT -5
roolacksreality said:
Karma for you, blaze. I'm going to school next year to do a History major and I love this stuff. My favorite decades in American history were the 20s, 50s, and 60s.
the cool think about the 20's is the movies mad eit seem like the 20's lasted till 1949
Karma for you, blaze. I'm going to school next year to do a History major and I love this stuff. My favorite decades in American history were the 20s, 50s, and 60s.
Sweet man! I am going to school for history next year as well and those are some of my favorite decades as well. Although I'm still a big fan of the 70's as well. I belonged in the 60's though. I was born in the wrong time.
"Disobedience, in the eyes of anyone who has read history, is man's original virtue. It is through disobedience and rebellion that progress has been made." Oscar Wilde (1854 - 1900), The Soul of Man Under Socialism
"You're either on the bus or off the bus." Ken Kesey
"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro." Hunter S. Thompson
The thing about the 60's is that everything was happening at once; Civil Right movement, Women's Right's Movement, Vietnam, Drugs in the mainstream, Race to the Moon, Assasinations everywhere (MLK,JFK, RFK, Malcom X, etc.), along with the starts of - Nuclear Brinksmanship, Israel/Arab War, Mass media/advertising. (If it was written as fiction, no one would believe it.)
Also America changed after WWII. We became a SUPERPOWER and became paranoid (McCarthyism) and overly self protective. We created the CIA and the military/industrial complex. We began to more readily stick our nose in everyone's business around the world.
The whole world was changing at once and many didn't like the way it was changing. The Baby boomers thought they could change everything for the better, but were young and idealistic and got lost in the drugs and selfishness. The old guard thought this change was the problem and just wanted to go back to "The good ole days."
Neither side was being realistic and both sides were angry and scared. I missed it all by about 10 years. Though I'd usually side with the idealistic dreamers, I understand both sides.
Post by blazeaway54 on Apr 16, 2007 4:44:43 GMT -5
I'm reading a book right now called Storming Heaven: LSD and the American Dream and there's a brief passage about Albert Hoffman and his early experiments with acid. At one point he's giving it to different animals and watching their reactions. The cats range from nervous to cathartic, the spiders build intricate webs, and so on. The author of the book points out an interesting and oddly predictive reaction in the chimps, though. A chimp is given acid and then returned to the chimp colony where "within in minutes, things are in an uproar". The chimp didn't act necessarily strange, but it didn't really interact with the others or engage in "social niceties". In a lot of ways this is representative of the teenagers in the 60s, in that they didn't really go insane and start killing people or eating babies as the media/parents would have you believe, they just rejected what society offered and took their own path. So while I believe that the movement was definitely self-centered I don't think it could have been any other way; the kids were fed up with with was around them (be it the draft/war or the strict social expectations) and decided to just focus on themselves, which shocked society and sort of made things grind to a halt and eventually reevaluate itself. It's probably the most productive thing that being self-centered has ever done.
Post by canexplain on Apr 16, 2007 11:08:05 GMT -5
i was at both WS 69 and Altamont, and have bored people to death with some memories so i wont do it again, but yes, that was the death of the movement that Dec day in 69 .... it was a sad day for all of us "hippies" back then ... cr*****
Post by roolacksreality on Apr 16, 2007 15:47:25 GMT -5
blazeaway54 said:
I'm reading a book right now called Storming Heaven: LSD and the American Dream and there's a brief passage about Albert Hoffman and his early experiments with acid. At one point he's giving it to different animals and watching their reactions. The cats range from nervous to cathartic, the spiders build intricate webs, and so on. The author of the book points out an interesting and oddly predictive reaction in the chimps, though. A chimp is given acid and then returned to the chimp colony where "within in minutes, things are in an uproar". The chimp didn't act necessarily strange, but it didn't really interact with the others or engage in "social niceties". In a lot of ways this is representative of the teenagers in the 60s, in that they didn't really go insane and start killing people or eating babies as the media/parents would have you believe, they just rejected what society offered and took their own path. So while I believe that the movement was definitely self-centered I don't think it could have been any other way; the kids were fed up with with was around them (be it the draft/war or the strict social expectations) and decided to just focus on themselves, which shocked society and sort of made things grind to a halt and eventually reevaluate itself. It's probably the most productive thing that being self-centered has ever done.
Read Todd Gitlin's The 60s: Years of Hope, Days of Rage and (preferably Acid Dreams by Martin Lee and Bruce Shlain
Yeah, unfortunately most of the "hippies" replaced the spirit of love and freedom with fear and greed whilst becoming "baby boomers". They rationalized away all of their ideals in order to breed and seek comfort in the suburbs.
And as an unfortunate consequence, everyone since then who is principled or holds to ideals is categorized and trivialized as a "hippie". The word has taken on a new meaning, with thanks largely to the original hippies themselves.
What is everyone's opinions on communes in the 60's? I am doing a project in school and would like some imput. What was the point of most communes? Were these communes sucessful at proving a point? Have any of you had experiences living in communes?
Do a search on "The Farm, Tennessee". That is where the many of the Merry Pranksters ended their long strange trip. It was THE commune in the early 70's. Too many people ended up there eventually and it had trouble supporting them all. Today it is a functioning model of alternative utopian lifestyles. They offer permaculture workshops, haybale construction seminars, solar panel install clinics, organic farming internships, gourmet mushroom growing workshops and much more.
Basically, they found a way to package what they believed in, and offer it up for sale while also healing the planet.
Your paper would be lacking without reference to this...
I have not but you may want to check this one out in WV. I actually learned of it when I ran into a member passing out "Stop Bitching and Start a Revolution" bumber stickers on my way back from The Dead playing. All I know is what I read on their website. Interesting to say the least. www.zendik.org
so i wont do it again, but yes, that was the death of the movement that Dec day in 69 .... it was a sad day for all of us "hippies" back then ... cr*****
