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Don't be sorry. So much for discussion. Have a good one.
Edit: If you would like to question what I meant by any fragment of any statement I make, please do so, for clarification. That is discussion. Assuming parts of what I said in the worst possible light, are not. Parts my not be worded in the best or clearest possible way. I see no indication that he is threat to anyone.....on this message board or outside it for that matter.
If anyone else would like to have a discussion about this, please do. It is obviously an important issue to some.
I guess you really want me to address this entire post, so I guess I will. Although it's pretty amazing that you take that last post as me not being able to discuss this rationally. Do you actually not realize how ridiculous you sound?
In my past I have done things that would have brought felony charges. I was not caught, I faced no punishment. I am not exactly proud of my past life but I am not exactly repentant either. And I certainly would not be to people on the internet I have never met, if I was dumb enough to give those accounts on a message board. Do you want to ban me now?
Did you rape a child? I'd like to think there are certain things that are beyond "Everyone's got some skeletons in their closet". And I would hope that things like child rape, and, say, murder would fit that bill.
I have friends from High School that did some horrible things all those years ago. Some served lengthy jail terms. For the past 15-20 years they have turned themselves into pretty good people. If they would have continued on that path I would not have remained friends, but they did not. Nor did I.
See above.
Having this knowledge does change things. Since there is a history, if Ron would contact a young woman on here or make an inappropriate comment or advocate for underage prostitution I would not hesitate to ban him. I have not seen any of that behavior on here.
Have you ever considered that there are likely multiple victims of child abuse (obviously not underage mexican prostitutes, but victims all the same) that post on this forum? How do you think they feel about seeing this fellow posting freely once they find out what he is? Not to mention that this whole "Let's wait and see, he hasn't done anything bad LATELY, and maybe he's a changed man" attitude led directly to sproat putting a board member in the hospital
Is Ron an open advocate for having sex with underage prostitutes? Has he done it since the initial incident? I believe that makes a difference. I understand he is not repentant. At least to you guys. I am sure I would not be either, no matter how I truly felt about it, if I was being mauled.
I really have a hard time grasping how you can type this stuff. Do you realize what you're defending? "Well, if I had banged 5 underage prostitutes in tijuana, I'd probably do the same thing...". This is beyond the pale.
I have thought a lot about what I want this community to be. I have been thinking about for years, in fact. That is a quite a comment coming from you, a self professed "Jokeman Troll" a lot do not want trolls around here, and they feel strongly about that as well.
This is the 2% that I addressed in previous posts
Look, we are not advocating or condoning what he did.
You don't want to, and you'll say you're not because you truly want to believe that, but that's exactly what you are doing. Sorry if that's hard to swallow
We are not thinking about letting him move into a commune to live in close quarters with our family and loved ones. This is a message board. I feel like, being a message board, he poses no threat to any underage girls on here (If he is actually a threat, in any way). He has actually caused less trouble than a lot of others around here, excluding this horrible detestable revelation from the past.
Let me ask you a question, mods: If the underage mexican prostitutes were 11 years old, would you have banned him as soon as you found out? If your answer is yes, then not taking action is implicitly condoning what he did as "not so bad", whether you want to admit it or not. If your answer is no, WHAT THE F*CK IS WRONG WITH YOU???
Gibran, please respond to this part of my original post. Since you're such an advocate of responding to entire posts and not leaving anything out. I'm genuinely curious as to how you would answer this question
Let me ask you a question, mods: If the underage mexican prostitutes were 11 years old, would you have banned him as soon as you found out? If your answer is yes, then not taking action is implicitly condoning what he did as "not so bad", whether you want to admit it or not. If your answer is no, WHAT THE F*CK IS WRONG WITH YOU???
Gibran, please respond to this part of my original post. Since you're such an advocate of responding to entire posts and not leaving anything out. I'm genuinely curious as to how you would answer this question
I most certainly will. I am hitting the road right now. Will respond later.
Gibran I have posted something in the Mod section that I would like you to read first.
If you guys will give us time to discuss this. As I said, yesterday was the first day for a call for a ban. We are NOT saying we won't take action.
I would like more opinions on the subject from other regular posters. I know it might seem like we are not taking your opinions into account I can assure you that we are.
Gibran I have posted something in the Mod section that I would like you to read first.
If you guys will give us time to discuss this. As I said, yesterday was the first day for a call for a ban. We are NOT saying we won't take action.
I would like more opinions on the subject from other regular posters. I know it might seem like we are not taking your opinions into account I can assure you that we are.
Thank you
Ugh, I really don't want any part of this, but I am a fairly regular poster on this board and feel like I'm part of the community here. I found the confession reprehensible and the follow up responses from the confessor baffling, weird, and at times alarmingly creepy.
But were talking about banning someone from the board for something they admitted to doing before the internet even existed. That doesn't make the act any less disturbing and reprehensible. I'm not saying people should find it in their hearts to forgive him. But banning him from the board doesn't make much sense to me.
What is it exactly we're banning him for? As far as I can tell he isn't breaking any board rules, or deliberately trying disrupt the community. In fact he hasn't made a single post on this board regarding this unsavory mess (but he's definitely logged in). Has he stalked anyone's facebook profile and tried to solicit their kids? Has he made advances on underage members of this board? As far as I know he hasn't. I want to make it very clear that I am not apologizing for or in any way defending what he did or how he's responded to the shit storm he's unleashed.
Post by Delicious Meatball Sub on Nov 16, 2013 19:54:48 GMT -5
I don't care one way or the other if Ron is banned, half his posts were made up bullsh*t anyway. But banging child prostitutes on your lunch hour is literally one of the most despicable things a human being can do. I think the mods would be well within their rights to ban him on that alone. Were he to show up and say what a horrible, drug-induced decision it was and that it haunts him every day of his life, I'd be willing to forgive him. But he's taking the exact opposite stance on the matter, trying to justify what he did and telling his opponents to "get a world view." So he can go f*ck himself for all I care.
Were he to show up and say what a horrible, druq-induced decision it was and that it haunts him every day of his life, I'd be willing to forgive him. But he's taking the exact opposite stance on the matter, trying to justify what he did and telling his opponents to "get a world view." So he can go f*ck himself for all I care.
That's the part I found baffling, weird and alarmingly creepy. And this is all I have to say on the topic. If he is banned and that's the decision of the mods I'm not going to loose any sleep over it.
Is Ron an open advocate for having sex with underage prostitutes? Has he done it since the initial incident? I believe that makes a difference. I understand he is not repentant. At least to you guys. I am sure I would not be either, no matter how I truly felt about it, if I was being mauled.
This might be the single most insane thing I've ever read in my six years on Inforoo.
If Ron had said "yes, I made a terrible mistake once and it's haunted me ever since," I might have been able to look past it eventually. But not only did he show zero remorse for his actions, he then went on to attempt to justify them (on the Coachella boards, that is; I don't think he ever responded to the allegations here).
Now, I'm not advocating banning members for things that happen off the board, because that can get into a grey area really quickly. But he chose to reveal that information online (albeit on another forum), and he should have to face the consequences that go with that. I would expect nothing less to happen to me if I had made the same revelation on another board.
Why is it that you can't even talk about smoking pot on here, but having sex with child prostitutes? Hey now, everyone's different! I would really like to know at what point that line is drawn - because frankly, it seems you only care about things that might piss off Ashley Capps. To both myself and to the law, what Ron did is tantamount to rape. Not only was his victim too young to give consent, but as a victim of sex trafficking, she really had no other option. And I'd really rather not have to condone that sort of individual in this community.
Now, I'm not advocating banning members for things that happen off the board, because that can get into a grey area really quickly.
Then what are the consequences for this behavior?
because frankly, it seems you only care about things that might piss off Ashley Capps
That is not true. I'm sorry if that is how my earlier explanation of why no Capp Dogg came across. I was trying to explain why we did not allow that parody to go on.
I appreciate your honesty and opinion on this subject though.
So you believe this, too? Is that something to consider?
I messaged this to Druid, but it bears repeating here, I think. Lets say you are right. He's just saying it for a reaction. Who the f*ck trolls about having sex with underage prostitutes? emoney, Larry Farnsworth and Flanz, for example, say some crazy sh*t, but they have boundaries. I don't know how much I would really like to associate with someone who would think that's appropriate at all.
P.S. I like all of them, so I am not trying to make them look bad.
I'm not pushing back because it is you guys. I'm honestly trying to get a handle on a situation I have never, thank God, had to deal with. I just want to know how we rationalize banning someone for something they did in their personal lives that they never said on this board.
Is this not circumstantial evidence Juggs? How do we convict on that?
Pretty sure that us engaging you, Juggs, is the exact opposite of whitewashing the issue. This is an issue removed from the board that you decided to bring here, knowing that we'd appear to be the bad folks, because it's teenage prostitutes and sex and the confused ramblings of an old hippie. How can we not address this? You got your way. We're hashing it out. Wanna bring up your troll accounts again or can you keep on topic and avoid treating this like a hostage situation?
Pretty sure that us engaging you, Juggs, is the exact opposite of whitewashing the issue. This is an issue removed from the board that you decided to bring here, knowing that we'd appear to be the bad folks, because it's teenage prostitutes and sex and the confused ramblings of an old hippie. How can we not address this? You got your way. We're hashing it out. Wanna bring up your troll accounts again or can you keep on topic and avoid treating this like a hostage situation?
Pretty sure that us engaging you, Juggs, is the exact opposite of whitewashing the issue. This is an issue removed from the board that you decided to bring here, knowing that we'd appear to be the bad folks, because it's teenage prostitutes and sex and the confused ramblings of an old hippie. How can we not address this? You got your way. We're hashing it out. Wanna bring up your troll accounts again or can you keep on topic and avoid treating this like a hostage situation?
This is less about you than you seem to think.
Except the same handful of people have their hands in 90% of the issues on the board - legitimate or not. There are a handful of us who have to address these issues, so yeah - it winds up being about us to some degree. Not as individuals necessarily, but as a small group who you and others decide to challenge at every single turn.
Pretty sure that us engaging you, Juggs, is the exact opposite of whitewashing the issue. This is an issue removed from the board that you decided to bring here, knowing that we'd appear to be the bad folks, because it's teenage prostitutes and sex and the confused ramblings of an old hippie. How can we not address this? You got your way. We're hashing it out. Wanna bring up your troll accounts again or can you keep on topic and avoid treating this like a hostage situation?
First, I take offense to the Capp Dogg being described as a "troll account." Give a little credit, please.
You're right, "whitewashing" was the wrong term. "Excusing" is the word I should have used.
And when I brought this issue here, I didn't know that you'd appear to be the bad folks. You know why? Because I assumed anyone with half a rational thought in their brain would say "hmmmm, here's a guy who admitted to having sex with underage prostitutes, then when confronted about it didn't show remorse, or say he was just kidding, but instead decided to rationalize it and make excuses - that's not okay." Long story short, I didn't think you'd "appear to be the bad folks" because I expected you to be the good folks. It's not like this is me, or emoney, or Flanz or Phi or anyone else making inappropriate jokes that make people uncomfortable, where there's a grey area as to where you draw the line. This is someone admitting to the commission of a pretty heinous act. It's not a joke.
And please stop describing this in terms like "the confused ramblings of an old hippie." You make it sound like Ron is some invalid who doesn't know where he is. He's only in his 60s, and it seems like this only happened 10 years ago. He may be a burnout acid casualty of the highest order, but it's not as if he's some confused octogenarian who is saying things that aren't true due to early onset of dementia.
And there you go. We're suddenly teenage prostitute sexing apologists.
If we act impulsively, we're power hungry mods. If we try to consider the circumstances, we're sympathizers. I get that it's an awful topic. No one is disputing that. At the same time, we're trying to be rational in the face of something totally "cut and dry" that didn't even occur on the board we moderate.
This isn't a courtroom. Why don't you all make it easier on yourselves and go with your gut instinct.
Because my gut instinct tells me that people are trying to exploit a seemingly terrible thing for their own advantage. Maybe if Juggs and others hadn't wrapped this automatically losing issue around the restoration of a less than funny troll account my gut would tell me otherwise.
This isn't a courtroom. Why don't you all make it easier on yourselves and go with your gut instinct.
Because my gut instinct tells me that people are trying to exploit a seemingly terrible thing for their own advantage. Maybe if Juggs and others hadn't wrapped this automatically losing issue around the restoration of a less than funny troll account my gut would tell me otherwise.
Now, I'm not advocating banning members for things that happen off the board, because that can get into a grey area really quickly.
Then what are the consequences for this behavior?
Oh, don't get me wrong - I definitely think in this case, he should be banned. I just meant that using that as a general rule could get really iffy really quickly. if members have personal drama outside the board, then that's their personal business and shouldn't affect their membership here. These things need to be judged on a case-by-case basis, but I think what canexplain did falls waaay on the other side of what's excusable.
I have been getting PM's from other members that do not feel it is so cut and dry.
Indeed, the easy way would be to ban.
Holy God. You're serious.
Holy God, I am.
Honest question. This confession happened several weeks ago on the Coachella board, correct? And you and a few others made passing jokes about it over here. Why just now a call for his ban?
