Whether it's your first Bonnaroo or you’re a music festival veteran, we welcome you to Inforoo.
Here you'll find info about artists, rumors, camping tips, and the infamous Roo Clues. Have a look around then create an account and join in the fun. See you at Bonnaroo!!
Post by esprituptohere on Mar 5, 2008 18:12:13 GMT -5
I've only got a three hour drive to the farm, but I know there are a lot of people coming in from distant areas. Being pulled over by highway patrol officers is no fun, as I've learned from experience, and sometimes speed limits, vehicle ordinances, and cop demeanor are really varied in different states.
One thing that does NOT vary by state is our protections under the fourth and fifth amendment. Law students sometimes carry a pocket Constitution, but this could seriously hurt your reputation, so here's a link to a site that explains your rights and gives advice on what to do in any encounter with law enforcement. If you don't know your rights, it's easy to have them violated.
While I'm a huge advocate for the Bill of Rights and personal privacy, remember that Bush and his Supreme Court have drastically weakened the Constitutional protections to privacy during their reign. Rightly or wrongly (mostly wrongly) police are now given almost complete discretion as far as probable cause.
So if you choose to invoke your rights, pick your battles. You will likely be forced to defend them in court and be prepared to miss the festival.
It is a sad statement that America is one of the lesser free counties but it is true. Your privacy has given way to fear and government intrusion.
BTW, if you choose to stand and fight for your rights, you have my respect regardless of the outcome.
Post by kingofcheezwiz on Mar 5, 2008 18:58:36 GMT -5
esprituptohere said:
Law students sometimes carry a pocket Constitution, but this could seriously hurt your reputation
I own a pocket constitution, and I was being hassled by a cop one day, trying to get me to open up my backpack. All that was in it was my books for school, and some notebooks. No weapons or druqs or anything questionable, so I really had nothing to hide. But I started to defend my rights saying that he had no probable cause and that I was merely on my way to class (it was actually a Political Science class, ironically enough) and didn't want to be late. He kept walking in front of me saying that I was going to be late if I didn't open my bag. I kept telling him no, and told him if he didn't stop hassling me, I was going to file a law suit against him and the entire Port Huron Police Department, because this was harassment. He told me I'd have a fat chance of proving it in court, and I responded with, "not too hard. I have a copy of the constitution and I will read you where it says I am free of self incrimination and harassment from officers." At that he backed down and said to have a good day and that I better, "watch what I do from now on." Moral of the story, defend your rights, even if you have nothing to hide. When you stop defending them, they will take them away. They have already started.
Post by arlenefavreau1 on Mar 5, 2008 18:59:40 GMT -5
You must remember that we as citizens loose more rights each and every day under the guise of " for the good of the people " all because we don't, can't, or won't get of the couch and shout "hey we can do this or you cant do that " if you want proof of this look at the stolen election of a popularly elected president or the carelus use of a weapon by our vise president where the victom was forced to appologise for getting in the way of the retard firing the weapon.1 out of 4 use marajuana daily yet here in the USA it will send you to jail for posetion.
"I want you to notice When I'm not around You're so fücking special I wish I was special But I'm a creep I'm a weirdo What the hell am I doing here? I don't belong here" -Radiohead
“Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.” -Benjamin Franklin
Post by GratefulHippie on Mar 6, 2008 1:04:57 GMT -5
dasclyde said:
First off, WHY!? All girls should have long hair. Did you donate to locks of love?
And second, it reminds of a south park episode i refrain from mentioning.
wait that looks like it would be fun to whip people with!
yes, it definitely went to locks of love
and i'm not worried about not having long hair. i thought i would be, but i'm not. the guy i went out with the night i got it cut absolutely loved it ;D
Post by esprituptohere on Mar 6, 2008 12:15:47 GMT -5
troo said:
While I'm a huge advocate for the Bill of Rights and personal privacy, remember that Bush and his Supreme Court have drastically weakened the Constitutional protections to privacy during their reign. Rightly or wrongly (mostly wrongly) police are now given almost complete discretion as far as probable cause.
This is true on many counts, but there have been a few recent Supreme Court rulings which have not followed this trend. For example, if two people live in an apartment, and one gives permission for police to search the premises, and the other does not, they are not allowed to search. Up until a ruling by the Roberts court, this was not the case. If even one roommate gave permission, the search was on.
Most of my frustrations with recent rulings have to do with things that are not technically considered a "search" that amount to the same thing (use of dogs, infrared cameras, bugs, etc.)
There was a case a few years ago where some guy was growing in a house, and the police suspected as much, but did not have any evidence to secure a search warrant. They borrowed an infrared camera and detected the heat from his lamps from across the street, gathering their evidence. The suspect's attorney tried to claim that this was a violation of 4th amendment rights, but the Supreme Court ruled that since the camera did not actually "penetrate" the home, but rather picked up on heat coming off the walls of the structure, it was not a search. There are plenty of "plain view" arguments to this issue, but using technology or dogs to augment one's senses and invade privacies sure seems like a search to me.
Post by SouthGA_Festival Machine on Mar 6, 2008 12:47:49 GMT -5
esprituptohere said:
troo said:
While I'm a huge advocate for the Bill of Rights and personal privacy, remember that Bush and his Supreme Court have drastically weakened the Constitutional protections to privacy during their reign. Rightly or wrongly (mostly wrongly) police are now given almost complete discretion as far as probable cause.
This is true on many counts, but there have been a few recent Supreme Court rulings which have not followed this trend. For example, if two people live in an apartment, and one gives permission for police to search the premises, and the other does not, they are not allowed to search. Up until a ruling by the Roberts court, this was not the case. If even one roommate gave permission, the search was on.
Most of my frustrations with recent rulings have to do with things that are not technically considered a "search" that amount to the same thing (use of dogs, infrared cameras, bugs, etc.)
There was a case a few years ago where some guy was growing in a house, and the police suspected as much, but did not have any evidence to secure a search warrant. They borrowed an infrared camera and detected the heat from his lamps from across the street, gathering their evidence. The suspect's attorney tried to claim that this was a violation of 4th amendment rights, but the Supreme Court ruled that since the camera did not actually "penetrate" the home, but rather picked up on heat coming off the walls of the structure, it was not a search. There are plenty of "plain view" arguments to this issue, but using technology or dogs to augment one's senses and invade privacies sure seems like a search to me.
If you think the technology is bad now, just wait until they perfect remote brain scanning, when that happens all freedom will vanish.
Any nation that gives up it's freedom for safety deserves neither and will lose both.
A majority of Americans are sheep. They don't care what the government does as long as they have their A/C, cable TV, strip malls, etc. The government has made us afraid, and we'll give up anything to feel safe.
I am all for protecting our rights. When dealing with the 4th and 5th, the rights are there to protect YOU as a PERSON, not to protect you from getting caught doing something that is illegal. It isn't a get out of jail free card. I will be rolling the dice on my drive to roo just like many of the others going, but if I get caught, I'm not blaiming the man...I'm chalking that up to sometimes you eat the bar and sometimes the bar eats you.
I find it slightly ironic what rights people are willing to fight for and what rights people are willing to give up with the drop of a hat. Trans fats were made illegal in New York City. Everyone thought this was a great day for a healthier society. But in all actuality trans fats only hurt the people that eat them, much like other things that so many people on this board enjoy. So everyone just gave up the RIGHT to put trans fats in your body. Not many people want to, but if you did, the government just made it illegal for you to have that CHOICE.
I'm sorry if this was way over the top, it's election time and I think I've been fed way too much politics lately.
Post by SouthGA_Festival Machine on Mar 6, 2008 13:39:52 GMT -5
iforgit said:
I am all for protecting our rights. When dealing with the 4th and 5th, the rights are there to protect YOU as a PERSON, not to protect you from getting caught doing something that is illegal. It isn't a get out of jail free card. I will be rolling the dice on my drive to roo just like many of the others going, but if I get caught, I'm not blaiming the man...I'm chalking that up to sometimes you eat the bar and sometimes the bar eats you.
I find it slightly ironic what rights people are willing to fight for and what rights people are willing to give up with the drop of a hat. Trans fats were made illegal in New York City. Everyone thought this was a great day for a healthier society. But in all actuality trans fats only hurt the people that eat them, much like other things that so many people on this board enjoy. So everyone just gave up the RIGHT to put trans fats in your body. Not many people want to, but if you did, the government just made it illegal for you to have that CHOICE.
I'm sorry if this was way over the top, it's election time and I think I've been fed way too much politics lately.
The thing about trans-fats is that children are fed them, as evidenced by the epidemic of childhood obesity and diabetes. Because their use is so widespread, even if all parents were intelligent and responsible enough to try and avoid them, they are bound to wind up eating some. The safe level of trans-fats consumption is zero. This is nasty stuff and should never have been legal to begin with.
Thanks to dear old W, and no one else apparently giving a damn, you can now be held/detained/jailed without ever being told why. Just like those third world countries we're told to be so afraid of.
Whether trans fats are good or bad for you is another debate. Personally I don't think they are healthy like most other people, and I don't eat them. My point is only this, the government just took away your right to eat trans fats and people applauded the decision made. Where does the line end? You keep walking down this road and we won't even be able to drink alcohol anymore. Once again the point is not whether or not the object that they out law is good or bad for you, it is the fact that they outlawed something that can and will only cause harm to yourself. I don't want to get into fascism but that is cutting it pretty close.
I don't know about doing it for the kids argument. But I live in FL and KFC doesn't put trans fats in their food anymore. Not because we have a law that bans them, but because it wasn't good for you and they are catering to what the people want. But I still have the right to imbibe trans fats if I want them....even though I don't. I just like having the option for myself and for others.
Post by SouthGA_Festival Machine on Mar 6, 2008 14:37:25 GMT -5
iforgit said:
Whether trans fats are good or bad for you is another debate. Personally I don't think they are healthy like most other people, and I don't eat them. My point is only this, the government just took away your right to eat trans fats and people applauded the decision made. Where does the line end? You keep walking down this road and we won't even be able to drink alcohol anymore. Once again the point is not whether or not the object that they out law is good or bad for you, it is the fact that they outlawed something that can and will only cause harm to yourself. I don't want to get into fascism but that is cutting it pretty close.
I don't know about doing it for the kids argument. But I live in FL and KFC doesn't put trans fats in their food anymore. Not because we have a law that bans them, but because it wasn't good for you and they are catering to what the people want. But I still have the right to imbibe trans fats if I want them....even though I don't. I just like having the option for myself and for others.
What if instead of t-f's they were putting rat poison or lead in food, as a preservative or something, would you still want that option too?
Post by spookymonster on Mar 6, 2008 15:03:51 GMT -5
Re: trans-fat; It was a safe target for the gov't to go after, thus giving the appearance of actually working in the people's best interests. Compare the number of recorded deaths due to trans-fats with either the number of deaths due to tobacco or alcohol this year alone and tell me I'm wrong. Unfortunately for trans-fats, they have no lobby to 'protect' them.
The government will never ban anything harmful to the American public as long as wealthy lobbyists stand guard over our rights to obscene consumerism. YAY, CORRUPTION!
Post by kingofcheezwiz on Mar 6, 2008 15:05:19 GMT -5
southgajd said:
iforgit said:
Whether trans fats are good or bad for you is another debate. Personally I don't think they are healthy like most other people, and I don't eat them. My point is only this, the government just took away your right to eat trans fats and people applauded the decision made. Where does the line end? You keep walking down this road and we won't even be able to drink alcohol anymore. Once again the point is not whether or not the object that they out law is good or bad for you, it is the fact that they outlawed something that can and will only cause harm to yourself. I don't want to get into fascism but that is cutting it pretty close.
I don't know about doing it for the kids argument. But I live in FL and KFC doesn't put trans fats in their food anymore. Not because we have a law that bans them, but because it wasn't good for you and they are catering to what the people want. But I still have the right to imbibe trans fats if I want them....even though I don't. I just like having the option for myself and for others.
What if instead of t-f's they were putting rat poison or lead in food, as a preservative or something, would you still want that option too?
Of course I would want the option. I want the option to put into my body what I want there. Not what policy makers define as "safe", because lets be frank, our safety is not their concern. Keeping the special interest groups and lobbyists paying the bills what their concern is.
iforgit makes some good points. I think that people should be allowed to ingest whatever they damn well please. However, alcohol prohibition failed once, and it won't be tried again for many years (if they do try it). This societies biggest druq problem has always been alcohol, but since the 18th amendment failed it will never be banned. And rightly so!
I whole heartily agree that they won't take alcohol away. But on a lighter note, when they make everyone believe that yellow-5 is bad for you, and they take away my Mountain Dew I'm going to be Pissed as hell. And I'm not drinking the red kind, that isn't Mountain Dew.
But back to the if your car gets pulled over thing...I really got us off on a tangent with all this TF stuff, and I'm sorry for that. Someone posted a really cool youtube video last year that was hilarious and entertaining at the same time. Like the opening scene in supertroopers. This is it The people who made it are the sames one the origional poster put in his post flexyourrights.org.
What are the chances of getting pulled over? Coming from Ct and staying in a hotel Wed. night. We probably have a 20 minute drive then on Thursday. It will just be two of us in a Town and Country van, very clean and only a few years old. No Roo signage or anything. Not that we would have anything to worry about , no open bottles or the like. Just curious.
, no open bottles or the like. Just curious.