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I don't think it's far fetched to think the mafia would want to keep the game going. Not necessarily for the townies' sake, but maybe for their own. Particularly where it was easy to do anyway, as Bogart hadn't said much one way or another, so the kill didn't put a lot of attention on anyone.
I still don't get the bogart whack. why would the mafia want to keep the game going? and risk being found out and killed off? I would think a quick takedown of strong players, or as Mike D said, a suspected inspector, would be far more to their benefit. I'm just not seeing this one.
If the mafia thought they knew who the inspector was, then yeah, I think they would have probably gone for that person. Maybe something Bogart said or one of his votes did make them think he was inspector, but since he didn't really say much, it seems more likely that they whacked him because doing so didn't really provide many good leads for identifying the mafia.
And the other side of the "why would mafia want to keep the game going" question is "why would the mafia want the game to drag on?" It just gives the townies more time to figure things out, and the mafia members more time to accidentally say the wrong thing and bring suspicion on themselves.
I still don't get the bogart whack. why would the mafia want to keep the game going? and risk being found out and killed off? I would think a quick takedown of strong players, or as Mike D said, a suspected inspector, would be far more to their benefit. I'm just not seeing this one.
If the mafia thought they knew who the inspector was, then yeah, I think they would have probably gone for that person. Maybe something Bogart said or one of his votes did make them think he was inspector, but since he didn't really say much, it seems more likely that they whacked him because doing so didn't really provide many good leads for identifying the mafia.
And the other side of the "why would mafia want to keep the game going" question is "why would the mafia want the game to drag on?" It just gives the townies more time to figure things out, and the mafia members more time to accidentally say the wrong thing and bring suspicion on themselves.
isn't keeping the game going and dragging it out more of less the same thing? I am confused by which point you are trying to make now. first it was that the mafia wanted to keep the game going:
I don't think it's far fetched to think the mafia would want to keep the game going. Not necessarily for the townies' sake, but maybe for their own. Particularly where it was easy to do anyway, as Bogart hadn't said much one way or another, so the kill didn't put a lot of attention on anyone.
now it's " why would the mafia want the game to drag on"?
my point has been the same all along. why would they whack a weaker (at least for this game) player, thus leaving stronger players in, and giving the town more time to figure it out and win??
If the mafia thought they knew who the inspector was, then yeah, I think they would have probably gone for that person. Maybe something Bogart said or one of his votes did make them think he was inspector, but since he didn't really say much, it seems more likely that they whacked him because doing so didn't really provide many good leads for identifying the mafia.
And the other side of the "why would mafia want to keep the game going" question is "why would the mafia want the game to drag on?" It just gives the townies more time to figure things out, and the mafia members more time to accidentally say the wrong thing and bring suspicion on themselves.
isn't keeping the game going and dragging it out more of less the same thing? I am confused by which point you are trying to make now. first it was that the mafia wanted to keep the game going:
I don't think it's far fetched to think the mafia would want to keep the game going. Not necessarily for the townies' sake, but maybe for their own. Particularly where it was easy to do anyway, as Bogart hadn't said much one way or another, so the kill didn't put a lot of attention on anyone.
now it's " why would the mafia want the game to drag on"?
my point has been the same all along. why would they whack a weaker (at least for this game) player, thus leaving stronger players in, and giving the town more time to figure it out and win??
I feel like you are trying to twist my words around. By keeping the game going, I mean having it actively move forward because all of the living players are around and able to play. By dragging it out, I mean allowing it to linger while one of the players is away from technology. I think that by keeping it actively moving forward, the town has less time to sit around and stew on things and figure them out than it would have if there is a several day lull caused by one of the players being gone.
I'm obviously not saying I know that's why the mafia killed Bogart, but I don't think it's crazy or outlandish to suggest that it was a possibility.
As far as whacking a weaker player, like I said, maybe something he said or did really did hit a chord with one of them, and they thought he might be the inspector. Maybe it's what I've already suggested in that they figured that killing him would (1) keep the game moving forward, and (2) not raise any significant suspicions. Maybe it is some other reason we haven't even considered. They almost certainly had some reason, but since Bogart didn't say a lot, it's difficult to speculate as to what that reason was.
well this discussion is going nowhere. I certainly was not trying to twist words just understand what seemed to me to be contradictory statements. still don't necessarily agree but thanks for explaining your POV.
I am wondering why no one else is talking or voting though... especially linana and Odysseus- I don't think either one of them has posted this round at all. I already still had some suspicions about linana, and silence doesn't help (at least to me). and ody was initially in the runoff for being quiet/not voting, so why repeat the same behavior?
For now I am going to base my vote off the overnight kill. I gave the thread a decent re-read and, to me, there are just too many other folks that called out and named names for the mafia to have no clue on possible inspector. This is from the perspective of Bogart being inspector - He initially voted Linana, basically cleared Jimmy and I of his suspicion, leaving Ody out of the discussion. This is when he had his vote on Linana still. I am leery of Ody, simply for the fact that Bogart never mentioned him, but this is a stretch, I know. Seeing how Linana and Ody have not chimed in at all makes me more suspicious of them as well. My vote is not 100% locked in as I would like to see what the two of them do with their vote.
It seems I am under suspicion is because I've been quiet, because Bogart voted for me and then got killed, and because I became defensive when put in the runoff.
I'm sorry, I haven't been online in several days. I checked in earlier today via mobile to see what had happened, but wasn't able to really go back and read like I would've liked to via mobile, so I didn't post anything. Am as bewildered as the rest of you re: the Bogart whack. I truly believe his vote for me was simply in response to my vote for him, a la first-day-voting-partner thing. Just piss poor luck for me that the random voting partner I chose happened to be the one who got whacked.
I tried going back and reading Bogart's posts to see if I could find anything that might offer a clue, but there isn't much there except where he said between Jimmy & Mike, he believed Jimmy was a townie moreso than Mike, then he said he wanted to hear from Mike before he put the "nail in his coffin" but he (Bogart) never came back and said anything after that.
This is my second mafia game, and I'm still learning the ins and outs. I guess it was wrong of me to hold onto any "bad" feelings about how the last game went, but it was really disappointing when the set up was so obvious and my fellow townies didn't believe me when I tried to tell them I was innocent. When Mike singled me out in the last round, it just gave me a sinking feeling like I was being put in the spotlight in preparation for another set-up. In retrospect, instead of getting butt-hurt over that, I should've used it to try & figure out the intentions of both people who brought my name up (both Jimmy and Mike).
I'm still not convinced that Jimmy wasn't mafia. I'm still not convinced that Mike isn't mafia. I think Tejas had a good point when he said the fact that Mike survived the whack is telling.
Also, Snakeface's responses have been a little strange, and it would be nice to hear something from Ody.
I'd like to see someone else in the runoff, but I'm not entirely sure yet who that should be. Right now I have a 4 year old shoving a singing kitty in my face because she wants my attention, so I'm going to come back after her bedtime, read some more, and see if I can figure out who I should vote for. Because my first instinct is to vote for whoever keeps putting suspicion on me, since apparently the mafia enjoy pinning things on innocent inexperienced townies, but apparently that's the wrong way for a townie to think in this game.
Just got home from a surprise theme park trip, sorry for the hold up, but this is a holiday weekend ya know. The back and forth on the Bogart whack isn't really getting us anywhere. I just don't think the connection between him and jimmy, linana, and ody or anyone for that matter really was that strong to begin with. I'm with o'neil in that I can't really understand why the mafia would want someone who wasn't going to be contributing for the first portion of the game gone. Honestly, if this game were being played out the way my mind works, Bogart technically should have been mafia (at least in my mind) because of having the quick two votes that just disappeared. Of course, that would have been too easy.
Of the things I have found suspicious thus far, both Phi's vote change and Snakeface's responses are at the top of my radar. The vote change is a bit thinner of an argument, and I'm only suspicious of it because it was that hail mary game changer hammer vote. That doesn't necessarily mean anything other than Phi woke up for a second and actually started reading the thread, but I don't know. I really don't like SF's whole "vote vocal then vote not vocal then just continually dig holes and contradict myself" responses. Could be a sign of a new player, sure, but it also looks like mafia scrambling for reasons to attach to votes.
With linana, I'm just not sold that she's mafia. Jimmy and his "I'm not defending linana" bit seemed a little over the top, and may have just gotten her name stuck in people's heads. Her "woe is me" attitude doesn't exactly scream suspicion, but I don't think it really is helping her case if she is town. I know there is much more content about her and from her, I just haven't done a thorough reread and wanted to get my earlier thoughts out before I forgot them.
With that, I am going to go with my strongest suspicion for a vote.
Of the things I have found suspicious thus far, both Phi's vote change and Snakeface's responses are at the top of my radar. The vote change is a bit thinner of an argument, and I'm only suspicious of it because it was that hail mary game changer hammer vote. That doesn't necessarily mean anything other than Phi woke up for a second and actually started reading the thread, but I don't know. I really don't like SF's whole "vote vocal then vote not vocal then just continually dig holes and contradict myself" responses. Could be a sign of a new player, sure, but it also looks like mafia scrambling for reasons to attach to votes.
Please go read my response already to NBF. I knew changing my vote so last minute would bring attention, but I think I made a pretty valid point. If I was trying to protect Mike D, why would I ever even let him be in the runoff? I still don't think jimmyroo was mafia, but after reading all the posts I came to the conclusion that keeping Mike D would benefit the townies more. After Mike finally posted his thoughts, it was apparent he likely wasnt mafia.
and since you decided to also stack on snake, i want to be sure we get a renough and not a straight vote out so im switching my vote. lets bring in the other quiet player and see what conversations sparks.
Of the things I have found suspicious thus far, both Phi's vote change and Snakeface's responses are at the top of my radar. The vote change is a bit thinner of an argument, and I'm only suspicious of it because it was that hail mary game changer hammer vote. That doesn't necessarily mean anything other than Phi woke up for a second and actually started reading the thread, but I don't know. I really don't like SF's whole "vote vocal then vote not vocal then just continually dig holes and contradict myself" responses. Could be a sign of a new player, sure, but it also looks like mafia scrambling for reasons to attach to votes.
Please go read my response already to NBF. I knew changing my vote so last minute would bring attention, but I think I made a pretty valid point. If I was trying to protect Mike D, why would I ever even let him be in the runoff? I still don't think jimmyroo was mafia, but after reading all the posts I came to the conclusion that keeping Mike D would benefit the townies more. After Mike finally posted his thoughts, it was apparent he likely wasnt mafia.
and since you decided to also stack on snake, i want to be sure we get a renough and not a straight vote out so im switching my vote. lets bring in the other quiet player and see what conversations sparks.
phi >>> snake >>> ody
The issue I had with the vote change was not one born of me thinking you were protecting Mike D, it was just that you had your vote up there from the beginning and then changed. Like I said, it didn't indicate anything other than you having an "oh shit! Mike D is going to get killed off and my vote was just random" moment. I stated earlier that of the two in the runoff, I preferred to have Mike D still around because I feel that he is an asset to the town while jimmy was just causing confusion.
not changing my vote right now but I would like to hear something from odysseus. especially since silence/lack of posting has been brought up as an issue in this game, I can't imagine why you wouldn't at least check in...
Okay so my thoughts on the Bogart whack is that mafia could have had high suspicion of him being inspector. I think if mafia doesn't have a good guess on inspector then they go after the most useful townie. In my opinion if they didn't have a good idea they would have whacked MikeD, but because they whacked Bogart that lead me to believe they had good enough reason to believe he was inspector. Plus the fact that they knew he was going to be M.I.A which would be very much in the mafias favor.
So with that it leads me to a few things to think about.
-Bogart was inspector and somewhere in the last 7 pages he did something to tip off the mafia
-The bogart whack was random and the reason for the most useful townie(MikeD) not being whacked is because he is mafia.
With that being said I'm leaning more towards the second thought. I feel uneasy about MikeD not being whacked. Also the fact that theirs no push to put him in the runoff is suspicious as well. I understand though why he doesn't have a vote(besides mine). No townies want to throw a vote on him because he gives good analysis of the players and seems to be very helpful. But If I were mafia I would try to at least get him in the runoff or something, but the fact that he has no votes combined with the fact that he didn't get whacked just doesn't add up. What makes a good mafia player is the ability to not only look like a townie, but to look more townie than the actual townies.
Honestly, when I started this post I was gonna throw a vote on a player to create a 3 person runoff but as I was typing this I convinced myself to keep my vote on MikeD. Please someone talk me out of this. I wanna believe MikeD is a townie but these things don't add up.
You're just too young to grasp how stylin' I really was. All the boys wanted to do me when I was 5. Actually the girls did too. My haircut was confusing.
You're just too young to grasp how stylin' I really was. All the boys wanted to do me when I was 5. Actually the girls did too. My haircut was confusing.
I wouldnt be against seeing a 3 way runoff with a combination of Mike D, Linana, Ody, or Snakeface.
I would also not be opposed to this.
my vote is still on SF for the odd responses, something about him is just coming across wrong to me. maybe he is a townie but his reasoning behind votes, and lack of direct response to some posts, I just don't like.
I do agree with the suspicions about Mike D. he does seem very helpful/townie and that's how jimmy came off (to me anyway) last game when he was mafia. and yes, I would think mafia would target him, and it's weird that they didn't. however, maybe the mafia left him alive for that reason, to make him look suspicious. not sure that I would take the chance, if I were mafia, since he does seem to come up with a pretty good analysis, and I wouldn't want to take the possibility of being called out. but who knows.
Ody, I would like to see in a runoff because of the lack of posting. it may not mean he's mafia but it's certainly not helping the town. my guess is that he's probably not mafia, because it wouldn't make sense to stay so quiet, I think, if he is mafia- simply because it does look suspicious.
and I'm still suspicious of linana, I feel like she isn't saying a whole lot beyond the repeated posts about being set up. and linana, I'm sorry if that's the case and you are being set up by the mafia, but I still haven't seen anything that reads as townie more than mafia from you.
I apologize for the lack of posting, but like I stated earlier, I was out of town from July 3-7. I had my computer but honestly never even had the chance to open it once because we were so busy. These are people I haven't seen in almost 2 years, so I wasn't really interested in sitting around on my laptop. That being said, I was under the impression that there would be some sort of break over the holiday weekend, and when I logged on last night for the first time in 5 days, my name was only tagged at the beginning of the round, so I didn't go into reading because I was tired and just assumed it had been slow.
You can feel free to put me in the runoff, I deserve it I suppose. I have no problem hashing out some theories, and I will try to do so before the runoff, but if it's not I will just focus on the people in the runoff, including myself. I understand my lack of posting has probably hurt the town some, so I will try to be more vocal, but just know my silence wasn't out of some mafia strategy.
Since there is a 3 person runoff currently with MikeD, SF, and Linana I think that's a good look. After catching up on the thread, I got the impression that MikeD was a townie. SF has always been suspicious to me and I'll point out that I was first to call him out on his "I'm voting for Jimmy because he's too vocal" statement. I'm not sure about Lin. She somehow convinced Jimmy she was not mafia, but I could see the argument for her being one for sure. I just don't think if her and Jimmy were both mafia that Jimmy would be so obvious about protecting her. I will do a full read-through (normally takes me several hours) and come back to give some more detailed notes with evidence.
my vote is still on SF for the odd responses, something about him is just coming across wrong to me. maybe he is a townie but his reasoning behind votes, and lack of direct response to some posts, I just don't like.
I do agree with the suspicions about Mike D. he does seem very helpful/townie and that's how jimmy came off (to me anyway) last game when he was mafia. and yes, I would think mafia would target him, and it's weird that they didn't. however, maybe the mafia left him alive for that reason, to make him look suspicious. not sure that I would take the chance, if I were mafia, since he does seem to come up with a pretty good analysis, and I wouldn't want to take the possibility of being called out. but who knows.
Ody, I would like to see in a runoff because of the lack of posting. it may not mean he's mafia but it's certainly not helping the town. my guess is that he's probably not mafia, because it wouldn't make sense to stay so quiet, I think, if he is mafia- simply because it does look suspicious.
Actually, I pretty much agree with all of that. I almost voted for SF but didn't want to be the one to stack a 3rd vote on him (why? idk; I guess I didn't want to seem like I was trying to avoid a runoff). Though I'm certain a runoff with me in it isn't going to benefit the town, since I know I'm a townie. I voted Mike again because for the second time, he's putting the spotlight on me for being quiet, even though I'm not nearly the only one being quiet. But maybe I'm missing the point. More on that later.
and I'm still suspicious of linana, I feel like she isn't saying a whole lot beyond the repeated posts about being set up. and linana, I'm sorry if that's the case and you are being set up by the mafia, but I still haven't seen anything that reads as townie more than mafia from you.
Well, I said in my last post that I was sorry for letting the past cloud my responses so far.
Looking back, there isn't much to go on with the whack, except that Bogart voted for me initially but ended up changing his vote to MikeD in the runoff. Mike voted for me this round based on the whack, but wouldn't Mike himself have more of a reason to whack Bogart than I would? Like the rest of you, I don't want Mike voted out if he's a townie because I know his reputation of being a great player and how helpful he could be to the town. If Mike is mafia, I kind of don't think Bogart would've been the whack, even though Bogart did vote for him in the runoff. I think it would've been someone more experienced, someone more vocal. But who knows how the mafia is trying to spin things.
Part of me wants to change my vote, because I'm not sure if a runoff with MikeD in it is going to be helpful. I'd like get some input from him outside of the stress of a runoff, see how helpful he really is before I decide how I feel about him. But there's not really anyone else (besides SF) that I want to vote for. So I'm sticking for now.
Oh, and WHY is the recent posts feature not working?!?!
Ref's notes: Due to the holiday weekend making some people away for days at a time, I've extended the round another 24 hours. So we'll be going into a runoff at 9 pm tomorrow (Tuesday). I really don't want to extend it much more than that though.
