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I would add that there is a significant amount of people who are not bothered by the accusations. Look at Aziz Ansari, who is back doing shows and TV now like nothing happened
Iirc, Aziz's sins were amateur hour compared to other people in this thread.
The only people that get canceled are those favored by white liberals. And that doesn't last long anyway, unless they do some truly heinous shit.
Morgan Wallen blurting out the N-word got him #1 songs. Drake is still messing around with minors. Etc...
I think Aziz's stuff is pretty similar to the Win accusations
Iirc, Aziz's sins were amateur hour compared to other people in this thread.
The only people that get canceled are those favored by white liberals. And that doesn't last long anyway, unless they do some truly heinous shit.
Morgan Wallen blurting out the N-word got him #1 songs. Drake is still messing around with minors. Etc...
I think Aziz's stuff is pretty similar to the Win accusations
nah, win has been accused of sexual assault by multiple young women. aziz was aggressive on one date but ultimately backed off, and there are zero additional accusations against aziz. very different situations.
Post by man1cpixiedreamgirl on Aug 31, 2022 11:57:36 GMT -5
Yah postgravy is right. When the Aziz thing broke I was like "Ok him and every other man who's ever been with a woman ever". That shit happens all the time, even though it shouldn't, but it's not to the Win level at all.
I think Aziz's stuff is pretty similar to the Win accusations
nah, win has been accused of sexual assault by multiple young women. aziz was aggressive on one date but ultimately backed off, and there are zero additional accusations against aziz. very different situations.
this really is my whole point. The victim in Aziz’ situation labeled it Sexual Assault. Some people agree with her that it was sexual assault. Some people think Aziz did nothing wrong. Some people label it as aggressive. It’s the same for any MeToo story.
nah, win has been accused of sexual assault by multiple young women. aziz was aggressive on one date but ultimately backed off, and there are zero additional accusations against aziz. very different situations.
this really is my whole point. The victim in Aziz’ situation labeled it Sexual Assault. Some people agree with her that it was sexual assault. Some people think Aziz did nothing wrong. Some people label it as aggressive. It’s the same for any MeToo story.
Much like Dante's Inferno, there are some pretty objective things in the rape culture pyramid. There are varying specifics in the different versions I've seen, but overall you get the gist of levels of severity. What's tolerated at the bottom leaves room for the top.
I was literally coming here to post that Leonardo DiCrappio and Camila Morrone broke up, coincidentally not even 2 months after her 25th birthday. He is fucking disgusting.
At least they're in their 20s though
It's def creepy, but not illegal (as far as we know)
this really is my whole point. The victim in Aziz’ situation labeled it Sexual Assault. Some people agree with her that it was sexual assault. Some people think Aziz did nothing wrong. Some people label it as aggressive. It’s the same for any MeToo story.
Much like Dante's Inferno, there are some pretty objective things in the rape culture pyramid. There are varying specifics in the different versions I've seen, but overall you get the gist of levels of severity. What's tolerated at the bottom leaves room for the top.
both aziz and win are in the Removal of Autonomy zone right or am I misreading the accounts.
Lots of rumors about Kevin Drew of BSS going around too. Not a good time to be an aging Canadian indie musician that likes to take advantage of young women it seems
She tried to verbally communicate her disinterest: “I said I don’t want to feel forced because then I’ll hate you, and I’d rather not hate you,” she said. Ansari appeared to understand at first, but soon continued his overtures. She said he only appeared to get the message when she emphatically said ‘no’ after he’d bent her over in front of a large mirror. He suggested they “just chill” on his couch.
At that point, said Grace, “It really hit me that I was violated . . . I felt really emotional all at once when we sat down there. That that whole experience was actually horrible.”
Afterward, Ansari called her a car. Grace said she cried the whole trip home. She texted Ansari after the date, explaining how uncomfortable she’d felt: “Last night might’ve been fun for you, but it wasn’t for me. When we got back to your place, you ignored clear non-verbal cues; you kept going with advances. You had to have noticed I was uncomfortable.” She explained she was telling him this so that “maybe the next girl doesn‘t have to cry on the ride home.” Ansari reportedly responded, “Clearly, I misread things in the moment and I’m truly sorry.”
Seems to have understood that "no" means "no" but not that "I dont want to feel forced" also means "no".
Post by piggy pablo on Aug 31, 2022 12:16:10 GMT -5
I like the idea of that pyramid but most of that stuff under degradation seems like it should be a level higher. Groping, revenge porn, upskirts, etc. are all pretty severe examples of loss of autonomy.
None of the pyramids I looked at I felt nailed it 100%, but I think we can all agree that generally it makes sense and is needed. When the bottom is excused, the top prevails. That's why the pyramid is made to begin with, to illustrate how none of these things are in isolation from one another.
Can they add the gift basket shit Derek Jeter did to all those women he went to bed with as a red flag on the pyramid?
There was a really funny story on Hollywood Handbook podcast recently (Or it may have been Flagrant ones....one of the podcasts with Sean Clements and Hayes Davenport) about a woman who was hanging with Jeter and had done the whole overnight thing you're mentioning already. She didn't realize until some point into the date or whatever that he didn't remember her and thought it was the first time meeting her. She recognized this but figured she knows what is in store so she'd go along with it. It wasn't until they got back to his place where his butler or whatever person on his staff welcomed them and said "welcome back" or something close to the woman and blew up her spot.
I forget how it ends but that must have been a super awkward moment
I was talking to someone at work about this and she said “You know the brain isn’t fully developed until 25, right?”
BOOOOOOO
Yeah I've seen countless memes the last two days that go "Leo when his girlfriend's brain finishes developing".
I also remember learning once that 25 to 26 is when our bodies start to degrade. Meaning we've literally reached our peaks and start slowly going downhill. I recall specifically being early into 26 when I noticed hangovers started lasting longer and I was first developing forehead wrinkles.
Kinda feels like Leo is just obsessed with youth.
May be bullshit, but I think I read somewhere Camilla was a family friend and he's known her since she was 12?
I was talking to someone at work about this and she said “You know the brain isn’t fully developed until 25, right?”
BOOOOOOO
Yeah I've seen countless memes the last two days that go "Leo when his girlfriend's brain finishes developing".
I also remember learning once that 25 to 26 is when our bodies start to degrade. Meaning we've literally reached our peaks and start slowly going downhill. I recall specifically being early into 26 when I noticed hangovers started lasting longer and I was first developing forehead wrinkles.
Kinda feels like Leo is just obsessed with youth.
May be bullshit, but I think I read somewhere Camilla was a family friend and he's known her since she was 12?
I just googled it...fucking gross.
Camila and Leo are so notoriously private that it may surprise you to know that they've actually been together since 2017, and known each other for at least ten years before that.
Late 2009
Camila's then stepdad, Al Pacino, introduces her to his actor friend Leo. Camila is 12 at this point, while Leo would have been about 35, so aside from maybe a game of Uno there's nothing to report here.
At a pub in Dublin, after rehearsing with my band, I read the same headline you did. We didn’t have any time to prepare for what was coming let alone a chance to decide not to fly across the ocean into the belly of this situation. This has been incredibly difficult for me and I can only imagine how much more difficult it’s been for the people who came forward. More than anything I wish healing to those involved.
This has ignited a conversation that is bigger than me, it’s bigger than my songs and it’s certainly bigger than any rock and roll tour. As I tried to get my bearings and figure out my responsibility in this situation, I received dozens of messages from the people around me, expressing sympathy for the dichotomy I have been pushed into. To stay on tour would symbolize I was either defending or ignoring the harm caused by Win Butler and to leave would imply I was the judge and jury.
I was never here to stand for or with Arcade Fire — I was here to stand on my own two feet on a stage, a place I’ve grown to feel I belong and I’ve earned as my own. I play for my band, my crew, their loved ones and all of our families, and the people who pay their hard-earned money to share space in the collective synergy that is a show. The ebb and flow of my successes, failures, and other decisions affect all of our livelihoods and I recognize how lucky I am to be able to travel the world singing songs about my life, my thoughts and experiences and have that be my career. I’ve never taken that for granted.
My experiences include the same experiences as the many people I have spoken to since the news broke on Saturday, and the many strangers whom I may only be able to reach with this letter, or not at all. We all have a story within a spectrum ranging from baseline toxic masculinity to pervasive misogyny to actually being physically, psychologically, emotionally or sexually assaulted. This situation touches each of our lives and speaks to us in a language unique to each of our processing. There isn't a singular path to heal when you’ve endured any version of the above, nor a singular path to rehabilitate the perpetrators. It can be a lonely road to make sense of ill treatment. I can't solve that by quitting, and I can't solve it by staying. But I can't continue.
Public shaming might cause action, but those actions are made from fear, and fear is not the place we find our best selves or make our best decisions. Fear doesn't precipitate empathy nor healing nor open a safe space for these kinds of conversations to evolve, or for real accountability and remorse to be offered to the people who were harmed.
I’m imperfect and I will navigate this decision imperfectly, but what I’m sure of is the best way to take care of my band and crew and my family is to distance myself from this tour, not this conversation. The last two nights on stage, my songs made this decision for me. Hearing them through this lens was incongruous with what I’ve worked to clarify for myself through my whole career. I’ve always written songs to name my own subtle difficulties, aspire to my best self and claim responsibility when I need to. And I’m claiming my responsibility now and going home.
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