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Why does it matter what Maynard (or any other musician) is like? In all honesty, any kind of art is about the art itself, not the artist.
I think because if your just a casual listener, he can come off as a bit of an ass and ruin it for you. When your used to a certain thing people have a hard time understanding "well thats not how Tool does things"
"They won't break me because the desire for freedom, and the freedom of the Irish people, is in my heart. The day will dawn when all the people of Ireland will have the desire for freedom to show. It is then that we will see the rising of the moon."
Why does it matter what Maynard (or any other musician) is like? In all honesty, any kind of art is about the art itself, not the artist.
I think because if your just a casual listener, he can come off as a bit of an ass and ruin it for you. When your used to a certain thing people have a hard time understanding "well thats not how Tool does things"
I mean, not just Tool but with any musician or artist in general. It shouldn't matter what they are like, personality-wise. Their personality isn't the subject of what they're putting out there, the art is.
I've always said that I really don't care what a musician or artist's personality is like, just as long as they bring the goods. And Tool brings it to the table, so they can be as big pricks as they like
I think because if your just a casual listener, he can come off as a bit of an ass and ruin it for you. When your used to a certain thing people have a hard time understanding "well thats not how Tool does things"
I mean, not just Tool but with any musician or artist in general. It shouldn't matter what they are like, personality-wise. Their personality isn't the subject of what they're putting out there, the art is.
I know what your saying, and for me and you we know that the set list doesnt change ever, we know that they dont jam out to tracks, we know that if the audience does something to piss Maynard off he will stop singing. We are fine with this, we embrace it, it is what it is for whatever reason. But to the casual fan who is used to these types of things, they have a hard time accepting it. Of course its about the art, but the personality does impact it to an extent and that is where there is the schism between hardcore followers and casual listeners.
"They won't break me because the desire for freedom, and the freedom of the Irish people, is in my heart. The day will dawn when all the people of Ireland will have the desire for freedom to show. It is then that we will see the rising of the moon."
Doesn't matter if it does or not, the personality isn't the focus. There shouldn't be any comparison for the two, and thus it shouldn't be an issue.
The art should be the only thing an artist is judged by (at least by the public)...whether it be musician, actor, architect, painter, sculptor, or whatever.
Doesn't matter if it does or not, the personality isn't the focus. There shouldn't be any comparison for the two, and thus it shouldn't be an issue.
The art should be the only thing an artist is judged by (at least by the public)...whether it be musician, actor, architect, painter, sculptor, or whatever.
It doesn't matter if he's a d*ck, but the meloncholy nature of his personality comes thru in the music. I mean c'mon... he's not making music about rainbows and puppies is he?
That's cool though, the world isn't all rainbows and puppies.
Doesn't matter if it does or not, the personality isn't the focus. There shouldn't be any comparison for the two, and thus it shouldn't be an issue.
The art should be the only thing an artist is judged by (at least by the public)...whether it be musician, actor, architect, painter, sculptor, or whatever.
It doesn't matter if he's a d*ck, but the meloncholy nature of his personality comes thru in the music. I mean c'mon... he's not making music about rainbows and puppies is he?
That's cool though, the world isn't all rainbows and puppies.
Its not always that simple. I've met members of death and thrash metal bands that are as chill and friendly as can be. And I'm sure there are people who make poppy, happy, positive music who are assholes. So you can't always judge the artist by the art...and you shouldn't. It should be 100% about the art anyway.
I only half subscribe to the notion that the artist and the art are seperate.
The end doesn't always justify the means.
For instance, "Shoe Company X" makes some comfy sneakers. So long as you don't mind child labor in atrocious conditions. The shoe is the art and the decision to use low cost labor was by the artist/company.
Yes, I know - consumer products are not unique works of art... (don't forget Worhol)... but I think it's a fair comparison. As for me, I believe recorded music is indeed a consumer product - it's only the performance that's art (because it is unique).
It would be cool to only judge the art and forget about who makes it. But humans are not that simple. For instance you toolheads (?) know all these things yet here we are discussing the band members and the lead singer especially. I think maynard is not as smart as he thinks because if you don't want something to happen....it will. He should know that by now. Tell people not to focus on him and all that does is help focus more on him.
Think about this....take a well known piece of art and study it....what would be part of the study?.....the artist....why he created it and why it exists period. The artist signed it for a reason. Without exploring that side of the art it holds less value and meaning. Sooner or later someone is going to question where the art came from. It's human nature. If tool made music and never did live shows or never released their names then it would just be music. But you can't expect people to not want to know why or how it was created. You can't act like god when you want to. If only the art mattered then I could make music and label it as tool and you would not know the difference. Especially coming to a loving festival such as bonnaroo. They better expect some love and take it as a compliment to the human spirit and not as an infatuation with maynard. I just feel like this guy needs a lesson in life. I really struggle to accept the fact that so many people can be obsessed with him and tool and at the same time know that he doesn't like that and still support him. If his music did not exist he would be very hard to swallow. You can say only the music matters but as soon as you find out who writes it it is a totally different and unavoidable ball game. that's humans for you...
It would be cool to only judge the art and forget about who makes it. But humans are not that simple. For instance you toolheads (?) know all these things yet here we are discussing the band members and the lead singer especially. I think maynard is not as smart as he thinks because if you don't want something to happen....it will. He should know that by now. Tell people not to focus on him and all that does is help focus more on him.
Think about this....take a well known piece of art and study it....what would be part of the study?.....the artist....why he created it and why it exists period. The artist signed it for a reason. Without exploring that side of the art it holds less value and meaning. Sooner or later someone is going to question where the art came from. It's human nature. If tool made music and never did live shows or never released their names then it would just be music. But you can't expect people to not want to know why or how it was created. You can't act like god when you want to. If only the art mattered then I could make music and label it as tool and you would not know the difference. Especially coming to a loving festival such as bonnaroo. They better expect some love and take it as a compliment to the human spirit and not as an infatuation with maynard. I just feel like this guy needs a lesson in life. I really struggle to accept the fact that so many people can be obsessed with him and tool and at the same time know that he doesn't like that and still support him. If his music did not exist he would be very hard to swallow. You can say only the music matters but as soon as you find out who writes it it is a totally different and unavoidable ball game. that's humans for you...
You have some good points, but I disagree. Thinking about the piece of art doesnt necessarily force you to think about the artist. Tool attempts to make the listener interpret for themself rather than focusing on why the artists did something a certain way or whatever. I know that most music listeners DO think about the artists along with the art, but just because they do it, doesn't mean thats how it should be. Art should be taken for itself, not for its maker.
It would be cool to only judge the art and forget about who makes it. But humans are not that simple. For instance you toolheads (?) know all these things yet here we are discussing the band members and the lead singer especially. I think maynard is not as smart as he thinks because if you don't want something to happen....it will. He should know that by now. Tell people not to focus on him and all that does is help focus more on him.
Think about this....take a well known piece of art and study it....what would be part of the study?.....the artist....why he created it and why it exists period. The artist signed it for a reason. Without exploring that side of the art it holds less value and meaning. Sooner or later someone is going to question where the art came from. It's human nature. If tool made music and never did live shows or never released their names then it would just be music. But you can't expect people to not want to know why or how it was created. You can't act like god when you want to. If only the art mattered then I could make music and label it as tool and you would not know the difference. Especially coming to a loving festival such as bonnaroo. They better expect some love and take it as a compliment to the human spirit and not as an infatuation with maynard. I just feel like this guy needs a lesson in life. I really struggle to accept the fact that so many people can be obsessed with him and tool and at the same time know that he doesn't like that and still support him. If his music did not exist he would be very hard to swallow. You can say only the music matters but as soon as you find out who writes it it is a totally different and unavoidable ball game. that's humans for you...
i agree with you to an extent. For instance, should the members of tool hang out outside a venue after a show, they are fair game. But when hes taking a stroll through the grocery store with his son in tow, he should be able to seperate himself from his art. I know several people who have met adam and danny, and all attest that they are the nicest people you will ever meet. I also know one person who approached adam and his girfriend while they were eating, and rightfully so was read the riot act.
I personally have done some reading on the members of tool and their life experiences to try to gain some insight into where they are coming from, and how it is different from my experiences and interpretations. I agree with you that it is human nature. But would i approach maynard in a public place if he wasnt doing something tool related? Absolutely not.
"When I was 4 years old, they tried to test my IQ. They showed me a picture of three oranges and a pear. They asked me which one is different, and does not belong. They taught me different....is wrong." -- Ani Difranco
Post by masshysteria on Jun 1, 2007 16:42:07 GMT -5
I really hope we have a few more songs on the bill then how many they have had all recent shows. The max I have seen were 11 tracks. If they go to at least 2 hours and 15 minutes that should give us at least 3-4 popular tracks, or 2-3 rare/longer tracks. Either way I will be happy no matter what.
"That's the big thing about education. People can be book smart, but not really intelligent about anything else. A lot of times they just taking in all this information and regurgitate it. It's much more important to process it and personalize it. To apply it to your world, to your life. You have to walk the walk, or you can't really report about it honestly."
I really hope we have a few more songs on the bill then how many they have had all recent shows. The max I have seen were 11 tracks. If they go to at least 2 hours and 15 minutes that should give us at least 3-4 popular tracks, or 2-3 rare/longer tracks. Either way I will be happy no matter what.
the southhaven set was 2 hours on the nose, so i dont think adding 2 or 3 longer tracks would work for 2 hours and 15 mins.
"When I was 4 years old, they tried to test my IQ. They showed me a picture of three oranges and a pear. They asked me which one is different, and does not belong. They taught me different....is wrong." -- Ani Difranco
Post by lucysiabanana on Jun 2, 2007 2:23:20 GMT -5
I have never understood Maynard's anger and frustration more than I did tonight. I saw them in Sunrise and I was practically front row. As soon as Tool came on the shoving and pushing toward the front began an pretty much skewed my experience. I was trying so hard to watch the band and embrace the music but 98% of the crowd were total drunk assholes. Eventually I got tired of it because the apes behind me started to MOSH during 10,000 Days...I don't even understand one even goes about doing that and not feel absolutely ridiculous. I asked a security guard to take me out and I then proceeded to enjoy the show from afar.
People are just really ignorant and ungrateful. Who gives a shit if they paid for their ticket, they're still dicks.
I have never understood Maynard's anger and frustration more than I did tonight. I saw them in Sunrise and I was practically front row. As soon as Tool came on the shoving and pushing toward the front began an pretty much skewed my experience. I was trying so hard to watch the band and embrace the music but 98% of the crowd were total drunk assholes. Eventually I got tired of it because the apes behind me started to MOSH during 10,000 Days...I don't even understand one even goes about doing that and not feel absolutely ridiculous. I asked a security guard to take me out and I then proceeded to enjoy the show from afar.
People are just really ignorant and ungrateful. Who gives a nuts if they paid for their ticket, they're still dicks.
Doesn't matter if it does or not, the personality isn't the focus. There shouldn't be any comparison for the two, and thus it shouldn't be an issue.
The art should be the only thing an artist is judged by (at least by the public)...whether it be musician, actor, architect, painter, sculptor, or whatever.
It doesn't matter if he's a d*ck, but the meloncholy nature of his personality comes thru in the music. I mean c'mon... he's not making music about rainbows and puppies is he?
That's cool though, the world isn't all rainbows and puppies.
I have never understood Maynard's anger and frustration more than I did tonight. I saw them in Sunrise and I was practically front row. As soon as Tool came on the shoving and pushing toward the front began an pretty much skewed my experience. I was trying so hard to watch the band and embrace the music but 98% of the crowd were total drunk assholes. Eventually I got tired of it because the apes behind me started to MOSH during 10,000 Days...I don't even understand one even goes about doing that and not feel absolutely ridiculous. I asked a security guard to take me out and I then proceeded to enjoy the show from afar.
People are just really ignorant and ungrateful. Who gives a nuts if they paid for their ticket, they're still dicks.
well if anyone won't mosh it'll be bonnaroo...so if that helps it'll be a lot better there. did maynard tell people to stop?
HEADED TO BONNAROO!!!!
