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^^I think you mean James Cameron. Although if the documentary were financed by Cameron Crowe, it would no doubt have a kick ass soundtrack .
To answer your question though, I've heard of it. Don't think it will make a lick of difference given the BCC ran a documentary on the same issue a decade earlier and pretty much all the archeologists in Israel, Christian or otherwise, discredit the claim as largely baseless. It's always fun to see who gets huffy about these things though isn't it?
Post by melikecheese on Mar 6, 2007 11:48:14 GMT -5
"Academic Stephen Pfann, a scholar at the University of the Holy Land in Jerusalem, said he did not expect Christians to accept the film's findings.
"I don't think that Christians are going to buy into this," said Mr Pfann, who was interviewed by the film-makers. "
Christians don't believe anything that goes against the little bible book. Sure they believe all the crap in that book but dear god they open there minds to anything else. The bible reads like a Harry Potter book, religion is stupid.
Post by barryzuckercorn on Mar 6, 2007 12:11:04 GMT -5
melikecheese said:
Christians don't believe anything that goes against the little bible book. Sure they believe all the crap in that book but dear god they open there minds to anything else. The bible reads like a Harry Potter book, religion is stupid.
Hey I take offense to that. I'm Christian, not exactly practicing, as I don't really know what I believe in anymore, but Christian none-the-less. I however do believe I am rather open minded, as I don't even believe a lot of what is in that book. You are over-generalizing. My mom is a Christian and believes in "the little bible book" but she is not close minded by any means. I think you need to think a little bit longer before you're simply going to attack people for a belief system.
Anyone see Real Time With Bill Maher this past weekend? He had this quote that perfectly explains my view on the situation, while talking about this same issue
"Philisophically, is it wrong to re-examine things you have believed your entire life, especially if, as in my case, they were shoved in your head when you were 3, beore you had any capacity for Critical Thinking? Is it so wrong to do that?"
Post by barryzuckercorn on Mar 6, 2007 12:46:26 GMT -5
mikede said:
"Philisophically, is it wrong to re-examine things you have believed your entire life, especially if, as in my case, they were shoved in your head when you were 3, beore you had any capacity for Critical Thinking? Is it so wrong to do that?"
I don't think there's anything wrong with that. Which is what I was trying to point out. I went to Catholic grade school, and Catholic High school, the first time I attended any type of public schooling was in college. However I am not confirmed, nor do I believe some of the stuff I was taught. I would hope people are open minded. My 16yr old cousin is going through some of the same problems I did when I decided to not get confirmed, as he doesn't want to be either.
I was simply pointing out the fact that if melikecheese were a little more open minded (like he professes he wishes others were) that he would see that not all Christians are close minded.
If you classify yourself as a Christian then you have to be closeminded. Because Christianity states that all other religions are false and the whole burn in hell bit.
Post by barryzuckercorn on Mar 6, 2007 12:55:16 GMT -5
killface said:
Not to take either side but......
If you classify yourself as a Christian then you have to be closeminded. Because Christianity states that all other religions are false and the whole burn in hell bit.
Actually not true, it is now believed (at least it was when I was a senior in HS) that as long as the person believes what they are doing right, and that they are not breaking commandments wilfully and without regret (ie murder) that will still go to heaven.
Also I don't understand why there's this attack on Christianity, I don't remember people from Al Qaeda attacking our soldiers because they had a correct religion. All religions believe others are wrong, Hindus do not believe that non believers can be reincarnated and thus eventually achieve Nirvana, Muslims do not believe Christians can go to their version of heaven, and I can't say for sure on the Jews, but I know that we are wrong in their eyes too. And I say that I am a Christian as that is what I was raised. I am not a practicing Catholic, go to church when my dear old grandma tells me I should, but that's all. I do not know what I believe and am very open to different possibilities.
If you classify yourself as a Christian then you have to be closeminded. Because Christianity states that all other religions are false and the whole burn in hell bit.
God does the judging,many Christians unfortunately take it upon themselves to do so, but Jesus made it pretty clear that mortal man is not capable of judging other mortal men.
Barry, why were you not confirmed?? If you dont mind sharing, and what are some of the things you dont believe in.
You say your christian, but everything thing else youve said seems to point that you dont really believe. Is it because you are afraid in a way to doubt what you have been told to believe your whole life? Im just confused. And please dont take this as an insult if its coming across that way. Im just curious
Post by barryzuckercorn on Mar 6, 2007 13:53:28 GMT -5
No it is not one of the commandments.
I didn't get confirmed because at the time I had pretty much renounced the idea of God. I had no problem lying to the bishop or priests or anyone who would be doing the actual confirmation, but I could in no way lie to my family and then receive any kind of monetary gifts from them at any type of confirmation celebration. I still consider myself a Christian for a couple reasons. 1. It is what I was raised and I learned about my morals and many aspects of my life through religion as a child. 2. I am not quite as against the idea of God as I once was. I am unsure of what I believe in currently, the idea of a higher power is hard to completely renounce as it is what I have been taught since I was a child. I believe whole-heartedly in science and evolution, which is somewhat counter-intuitive to Catholic beliefs. I think I would like for there to be a higher power, just cannot quite believe it currently. It's a weird situation, I don't really believe in God all that much, but I am pretty sure I believe in Jesus and most of the things he did. Which doesn't make sense, because I know they are supposed to be one in the same.
As far as what I don't believe: -Creationism--no possible way I can belive that the earth is only around 12k years old, just does not work for me in any possible way. -I do not like the fact that priests can't marry and that women cannot be priests. -Papal infallability bothers me alot. -There are definately problems I have with organized religion in general. I like to stick with the types of things my Grandpa taught me. More like it's about the faith you hold in your own heart. It doesn't matter what the Catholic, or Lutheran, or Muslim, etc religion says. The power of positive thinking prevails over all.
And don't worry mike I don't take offense, I enjoy conversations about religion, and I will be sure my kids learn all about religion and yes they will be going to church. I want them to be able to make the same decisions that I made. I know I could simply not teach them religion, and let them make the decision that way, but it's hard to learna bout religion if you haven't been in that environment.
I was brought up Christian my whole life. Went to a Christian H.S. and the whole nine(actually an evangelical Christian H.S.). So I've seen alot of hypocrisy in my time, up close and personal. I could tell you stories, boy howdy, that would blow you away, regarding overly-judgmental and hypocritical Christians. But the bottom line is that no one really knows for sure. It's all a matter of faith. If you don't have faith in something, then I'm not sure what you'd be living for. I don't call myself a Christian, because I'm not dedicated to living that lifestyle. I'm on a search for truth. And hopefully I will find that truth before I die.
Anyhow. Yeah, I don't really buy that they found Jesus's tomb. Jesus was actually a very common name back in those days. But I guess that this too, is a matter of faith. I don't like James Cameron to begin with, so I might be a little biased.
You can't prove or disprove God. Although, scientists will try their damnedest.
It's impossible to prove a negative, although I believe we might one day be able to prove God's existence. Until then, I'm firmly in the agnostic camp (or "Recovering Catholic" as I like to call it).
I didn't get confirmed because at the time I had pretty much renounced the idea of God. I had no problem lying to the bishop or priests or anyone who would be doing the actual confirmation, but I could in no way lie to my family and then receive any kind of monetary gifts from them at any type of confirmation celebration. I still consider myself a Christian for a couple reasons. 1. It is what I was raised and I learned about my morals and many aspects of my life through religion as a child. 2. I am not quite as against the idea of God as I once was. I am unsure of what I believe in currently, the idea of a higher power is hard to completely renounce as it is what I have been taught since I was a child. I believe whole-heartedly in science and evolution, which is somewhat counter-intuitive to Catholic beliefs. I think I would like for there to be a higher power, just cannot quite believe it currently. It's a weird situation, I don't really believe in God all that much, but I am pretty sure I believe in Jesus and most of the things he did. Which doesn't make sense, because I know they are supposed to be one in the same.
As far as what I don't believe: -Creationism--no possible way I can belive that the earth is only around 12k years old, just does not work for me in any possible way. -I do not like the fact that priests can't marry and that women cannot be priests. -Papal infallability bothers me alot. -There are definately problems I have with organized religion in general. I like to stick with the types of things my Grandpa taught me. More like it's about the faith you hold in your own heart. It doesn't matter what the Catholic, or Lutheran, or Muslim, etc religion says. The power of positive thinking prevails over all.
And don't worry mike I don't take offense, I enjoy conversations about religion, and I will be sure my kids learn all about religion and yes they will be going to church. I want them to be able to make the same decisions that I made. I know I could simply not teach them religion, and let them make the decision that way, but it's hard to learna bout religion if you haven't been in that environment.
Thanks for that explaination. Oddly enough, most of that are my views too minus a couple of things, but i consider myself Athiest.
Science takes faith too, it wasn't that long ago that doctors believed that too much blood was a medical problem, and treated it with leeches.
Exactly. I think it takes more faith to believe that we all came from a big explosion than that we were created by a intelligent being.
But there's reviewable evidence of a big bang, and none for creation by an intelligent being. They both require some amount of faith due to no one being there to observe the event, but the former is a scientific theory and the latter is a hypothesis.
If you classify yourself as a Christian then you have to be closeminded. Because Christianity states that all other religions are false and the whole burn in hell bit.
Wow. That was the most baseless and ignorant thing I've read on this board. That makes me sad.
It really sucks how evangelical Christians give the rest a bad rap. But that's because they make more noise than all the others. If you're forming your opinion of Christians based on these scuzzbuckets, you are the one who is close-minded. There are many right-thinking folks out there that believe in Jesus, are pro-choice, believe in evolution, etc. My high school Biology teacher taught evolution, and he was a Methodist preacher. The biggest problem with the Bible was the man that translated it, King James. It reads like grand literature, and that's no coincidence.
I believe in God, I think Jesus was a pretty cool guy. I don't know if that's enough to make me a Christian, but I don't care. You can't argue with love your neighbor, and the Beatitudes are beautiful. I never understood why evangelical Christians always focus on the Ten Commandments so heavily, which is Jewish law, but never bring up the Beatitudes? Maybe because brotherly love, shunning wealth, and being meek doesn't exactly fit their agenda? Personally, I think everyone gets in Heaven evetually, whatever Heaven may be. But believing the world is only 12k years old has nothing to do with your religion. That's just stupidity. And believing everyone that doesn't fit your set of beliefs is going to hell also trancends religion. That's just bigotry, plain and simple. People will always use whatever they can to excuse their bigotry, and religion has long been a handy one.
Exactly. I think it takes more faith to believe that we all came from a big explosion than that we were created by a intelligent being.
But there's reviewable evidence of a big bang, and none for creation by an intelligent being. They both require some amount of faith due to no one being there to observe the event, but the former is a scientific theory and the latter is a hypothesis.
So what created the matter to cause the big bang? I definitely don't know what happened, I prefer to think of it as a combination of God and Evolution.
Post by bojangles22 on Mar 6, 2007 15:36:42 GMT -5
Faith is good N' all, but i think so long as they is humans on dis planet, they will find a way to turn something good into a tradgedy. faith is powerfull and helps bridge the big gap between possible/impossible (cus it's all in the mind anyway) but often people become confused and start following what they think is theyre heart, when really it's just following their fears and safeguards/negative reflexes,. thats how people ironicly become hypocritical, because whatever your mind is "tuned" into, is they way you'll steer. some people use faith with more sense like "i am a human and there is no way to compleatly understand all that is around me and therefor i will keep an open mind to that which i do not understand" faith is what you can't explain but in itself is still an entity, there is a sort of poetry to it. some people just like to be right all the damn time! and faith is a way to be right without explaining anything. and anyone else with diferent faith is wrong. this turns spirituality into it's sub-par humanistic form which is 'religion'-the greatest murderer ever. so again you have something good-the human ability to thirst for answers. and then you have were it gets ugly- the self absorbed human that sais prematurly "i'm done, ive figured it all out. i know it all, yeay me! don't question it." and then so tries to operate their environment with this 'half-knowlege' being right in a wrong way. :ignorance:it's like where pride and fear collide in the mind of a person
ok i'm done rambling, that may have made some sense
And let's not forget that the greatest weapons man has created were not created using the bible, they were created using science. Just as the Bible is susceptible to misuse, science could equally be blamed for pretty much all of the world's woes (global warming, warfare, genetic mutations in plant life). But then, it's not science that's evil but the misuse of it.
Also, I'd just like to point out that theologically sound Christianity teaches that jugdment is left to the Lord and not a concern of man. The only concern of man is to love God above all things and the manifestation of that love is loving others as yourself. For the record, I consider myself a believer in Christ, but not a Christian. I could not claim to be a true follower of Christ's words. That would be hypocritical to say the least. But I do believe in the message and divinity of Christ.
Also, I'd just like to point out that theologically sound Christianity teaches that jugdment is left to the Lord and not a concern of man. The only concern of man is to love God above all things and the manifestation of that love is loving others as yourself. For the record, I consider myself a believer in Christ, but not a Christian. I could not claim to be a true follower of Christ's words. That would be hypocritical to say the least. But I do believe in the message and divinity of Christ.
I am a Christian (why do I feel the need to say "not one of THOSE Christians.") I was raised Catholic, studied several religions on my 20's (Hinduism, Taoism, Buddhism, Islam, Mormomism, Jehovah Witnesses, you name it), became a Buddhist. And found my Christianity near 40. I personally feel that Christianity is very compatible with other religions if you accept one thing. The Bible is not infallible.
IMHO (and this may offend some), the Bible was written by people speaking to different groups, with different cultures so the Gospels are different ( and in fact contradict each other in places.) I think the early Christians would be shocked and amused that some take the Bible literally.
I will gladly discuss my thought with anyone at B-roo who would like (otherwise I will happily keep my mouth shut, thank you very much.) But they are too complex to be summarized here.
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