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This really sucks for those in tent only if they do segregate us with some enforcement mechanism. What happens if a tent only person tries to hook up with a non tent only person, and the non tent only person has a campsite ill suited (people there or whatever) for a hookup? "sorry your lady friend or boytoy cannot come in with you"
hopefully that is not the case. we shall see.
I'd like to know the answer to this question also... If its not the case, then I'll just empty my car at that gate, and have friends move it to TO, and then just "visit" them the whole weekend
This really sucks for those in tent only if they do segregate us with some enforcement mechanism. What happens if a tent only person tries to hook up with a non tent only person, and the non tent only person has a campsite ill suited (people there or whatever) for a hookup? "sorry your lady friend or boytoy cannot come in with you"
hopefully that is not the case. we shall see.
I'd like to know the answer to this question also... If its not the case, then I'll just empty my car at that gate, and have friends move it to TO, and then just "visit" them the whole weekend
This really sucks for those in tent only if they do segregate us with some enforcement mechanism. What happens if a tent only person tries to hook up with a non tent only person, and the non tent only person has a campsite ill suited (people there or whatever) for a hookup? "sorry your lady friend or boytoy cannot come in with you"
hopefully that is not the case. we shall see.
I'd like to know the answer to this question also... If its not the case, then I'll just empty my car at that gate, and have friends move it to TO, and then just "visit" them the whole weekend
But, they don't have to enforce this the entire weekend. I'm thinking they believe that TO will fill quickly at any rate, and if they quarantin. You at your car, you're not going to be able to make it over there. Its why having one person in line could work, but I have a feeling you'll be locked down till Thursday morning, when tent only will likely be very full.
Also, I mean, if you're walking in, how much can one person really carry?
Why can't you guys wanting to do TO, just ride in with someone camping, and have them drop you off at TO?
That's easier said than done. Plus it poses a myriad of unforeseen logistical problems. Chief among that list is, would these campers have enough room for my crap (cases of water, gatorade, booze, more booze, tent, EZ up, cooler, etc.)? As the "Hump Day Scout" for my compadres showing up Thurs. it falls to me to have camp set up and ready as they begin trickling in. It's not a wholly selfless act as I enjoy various perks for taking on this role.
Now me, I drive a honda civic, the largest piece of gear I bring is the EZ Up and that barely fits awkwardly across the backseat on top of my supplies. My cooler is pretty small out of necessity and it rides up front. There is a minimal amount of space in my trunk due to the built in sub-woofer. All that being the case I don't have the option of someone dropping me off or vice versa and parking my car. I use my car as a locker and visit it a few times to resupply when my dinky (DINKY not DRINKY, though that is it's primary purpose) cooler gets low. So if I did ride in with other campers "Hey can I have a copy of one of your car keys so I can periodically come back and grab stuff?" :shrug:People are cool, I'm cool too, but I'm not THAT cool, so I wouldn't expect anyone else to be.
As far as my circumstances and the ability to follow through with our best laid plans, we're screwed. I've wracked my brain over it all day long and can't come up with any viable plan that could be set-in-stone doable.
Why dont people just meet in walmart parking lot and go into GA together
As some have mentioned some groups of us are being blown in from all four directions and arriving at various times, and in my case even days. Meeting at Wallyworld parking is not a practical solution for us.
Is there something wrong with just a regular GA spot in which you paid for anyway? I understand brunch may have to be moved but really im missing the whole big deal here.
Nothing wrong at all with the regular GA car camp spots. And for those folks all traveling from the same general direction it's a not at all impossible feat to caravan in and camp next to each other in the standard GA allotted spaces. But I think you are, as you said, missing the whole big deal here -
but when you carpool with a lot of people and PLAN to be able to take as much space as you need in TO... this is pretty restraining.
This. I always literally translated "Tent Only" to people with Only Tents. AC is now making it easier for those who need tent only to get tent only. What im hearing from these complaints is that people took advantage of the proximity of TO to centeroo. Its an insane web of tents and strings and tarps with no clear in and out. No wonder it was so packed. Probably 50% of those in TO didnt belong their. People were just wasting their 10x10 area as a parking spot and heading to TO with all their gear. That adds up to alot of wasted space that coulda been used for alot better things then for your car to collect dust for a weekend. I dont disagree with the move, just how long they took to let everyone know.
I want to go point by point. Please understand I'm not trying to take you to task or be argumentative, I just want to explain it in such a way that it speaks to your initial assertion that you don't see what the big deal is, and speaking for myself, why I do see a big deal.
I always literally translated "Tent Only" to people with Only Tents.
Accurate. Our cars are not near us, they are in some far off pod land that we migrated from.
AC is now making it easier for those who need tent only to get tent only. What im hearing from these complaints is that people took advantage of the proximity of TO to centeroo. Its an insane web of tents and strings and tarps with no clear in and out. No wonder it was so packed. Probably 50% of those in TO didnt belong their.
I believe this to be your fundamental misapprehension of both our anger (a righteous anger IMO) and the purpose of TO's existence prior to this new policy. First to the latter - while TO does serve people who have hiked, bused, or flown into the area, that was not it's exclusive reason for being. Even last year in the description of TO it was said that you could park and hump your gear to this area. I think it was itrainmonkeys who earlier in this thread posted their previous verbiage describing TO. It was not just the exclusive spot for those w/out cars. All were welcome but you had to hoof your gear in.
And now to the former...I had to quell my rage a bit before addressing this. Deep breath, count to 10...
AC is now making it easier for those who need tent only to get tent only.
For the past several years AC has done exactly the quacking opposite!!! They've shrunk that biznatch! quacking seriously dude, shrank it's ass to a smaller and smaller quacking area. AC doesn't give even half a shiz about people who "need" TO. They've been saying FUCCK YOU to those folks progressively louder and louder each year since what like 2010?!?! THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE NEEDS OF THOSE WHO BRAVE THE JOURNEY USING ALTERNATE MODES OF TRANSPORTATION! NOT A quacking THING! ...ok I've failed to remain calm. Happy place.. ..I simply must disagree with you on that point.
What im hearing from these complaints is that people took advantage of the proximity of TO to centeroo.
Quite true. There was nothing in the literature to lead us to believe that it existed for any other purpose. I'm pretty sure it's always said that you could park your car and haul your gear to TO if you want to camp closer to Centeroo. I'd love for some older vets on here to either back me up or shoot me down on that.
Apologies for the long and rambling post. If you made it this far the secret word is "Quarantine". I'll buy you a beer in centeroo! Limit 1 per 'Rooster
How minimalist do those of you in the "just park your car somewhere and take a taxi and then carry all of your belonings in" camp actually, well, camp?
Personally, I have an EZ Up, a tent, an air mattress, a pillow, clothes, a camelback, a battery powered fan and assorted odds and ends. I believe that it took me three trips from my car to Tent Only last year, plus another trip to retrieve my contribution to brunch. I don't camp too extravagently. I don't bring food (though I do bring water), a grill, etc. The items that I bring with me have been carefully cultivated over nine Bonnaroos to balance my comfort in the seven or eight hours a day I'm at my site with my desire not to cart a bunch of useless crap around in my car for thirty-plus hours.
I understand that there's a portion of Bonnaroo attendees that sleep on a blanket in a 4'X4' tent, who wear the same clothes each day and have not other provisions but I feel comfortable after nine Bonnaroos in saying that they are the vast minority.
^Pretty much spot on on every point. Roo'adelphia's assertion that people were "taking advantage" of TO is wildly inaccurate. It's always been there for anyone who wants to haul their gear from their parking spot and set up camp in TO, not only for those who bus in.
And the point about wasted space from people leaving their cars to head to TO? I can guarantee you that their neighbors love it!, they suddenly came into a lot more space without doing anything.
TO is like a community withing a community, taking it away this late in the game is a horrendous idea.
I can guarantee you that their neighbors love it!, they suddenly came into a lot more space without doing anything.
I forgot to address that. The first thing I do after parking and saying howdy to my neighbors is tell them feel free to divy up my space as I'll be in TO and not leaving till Monday.
On a different but similar note, I've always wished the camping space allocated to a car had some correspondence to how many people are in the car. Like if you had 1-3 people in the car, you got the standard 10' x 10', but if you had 4-6 people in the car, you got a 10' x 20' area or something. For Bonnaroo to keep touting itself as the "green" festival, they sure do discourage carpooling in this manner. Why would you want to carpool if it just means you'll be more cramped at the campsite. TO was one way to alleviate that. People could pack into a car to get to 'roo, then spread out a little bit at TO. Idk, not a big deal at this point, but just something I've always wondered about.
Email update: One of our inforoosters was kind enough to provide an email for Rick Farman with Superfly. (Via an an article -- no sinsiter lying to agents or anything like that going on!) I'm not sure if it's still active as he has not responded but it's a start. rick@superflypresents.com
I have also asked Ashley Capps via twitter if there is a monitored email to explain our frustration as 140 characters is insufficient. If he provides one I'll let you know.
On a different but similar note, I've always wished the camping space allocated to a car had some correspondence to how many people are in the car. Like if you had 1-3 people in the car, you got the standard 10' x 10', but if you had 4-6 people in the car, you got a 10' x 20' area or something. For Bonnaroo to keep touting itself as the "green" festival, they sure do discourage carpooling in this manner. Why would you want to carpool if it just means you'll be more cramped at the campsite. TO was one way to alleviate that. People could pack into a car to get to 'roo, then spread out a little bit at TO. Idk, not a big deal at this point, but just something I've always wondered about.
Also, they make it a really awkward process to try and camp with anyone in another vehicle even if you both arrive at the same time. Their on-site traffic folks are told to keep people moving which results in not being able to sync up once you leave the booths. When you get to where you are being parked you are parked two deep so there's a very reasonable chance that you will have your vehicles end to end or in the front of one row and the back of then next which makes it difficult to pool your space (and shade).
They really could stand to focus group some of this nuts and bolts operational stuff...
1-1-12 Bassnectar NYE SHOW! 1-21-12 G. Love and Special Sauce 3-1-12 Radiohead 3-9-12 Experience Hendrix 5-15-12 Jack White @ The Ryman 6-7-12 Bonnaroo 6-19-12 Roger Waters presents "THE WALL" 7-7-12 Ringo Starr's 72nd Birthday Party Extravaganza at the Ryman
I still don't understand how this is going to be enforced. Lets say I arrive late enough so I'm not in BFE (which will probably be quarantined like it was last year) and am still able to walk from my allotted spot to TO.
If I'm walking with my backpack and a tent in my hands, someone will stop me and say, "you aren't allowed to go to TO, you are in GA camping." I will then respond "I've been walking around here for hours. I'm exhausted and can't find TO. Can you point me in the right direction please?" How can they respond besides pointing me towards TO?
In terms of the towing cars...I don't see how they can possibly enforce that. It would take some balls to tow a car when I could have been a first timer that simply parked my car and "went exploring." Imagine the outcry if someone parks their car, goes walking around, then comes back and their car was towed b/c it didn't have a tent set up next to it.
One possible way is to assign people special TO wristbands when you arrive at the toll booths. No idea if this is what they're planning, but it is one thing that's possible. As far as towing, no idea on that. I'd imagine that's just an empty threat and wouldn't really be carried out. As has mentioned, there's no way to tell if said person went over to TO, or simply moved to camp with some friends.
This move really is against the Bonnaroo spirit and very disappointing.
The more I think about this the more irate I get. They have been shrinkin' TO since I started comin' in 2007 I'm pretty sure. If you wanted to encourage Groop fine, but waitin' until now is unacceptable to make this change to TO policy. I'm gonna have to use the other contact addresses when I have some time in the next few days.
I'm not sure how they would enforce it but I don't want to even have to worry about it. If they find a way and I am sent back to my car my camping space will have already been absorbed by my neighbors.
I do tend to agree with others that they must have been referring to cars parked on the edge of tent only when they were talking about towing. Anything else is just too stupid to be true, right?
A side issue separate from how indivduals may slip into TO is that it still doesn't solve The Brunch Issue. There is a lot of stuff that goes into that and we're not going to be able to simply cause a distraction and cart in a dozen EZ ups and tables and stuff and hope that nobody notices. (And I'm sorry if I am speaking out of turn re: brunch. I'm not really a player in that scene but it is an important aspect of this community so I feel inclined to stick my two cents in.)
Post by 3post1jack1 on Apr 19, 2013 0:02:48 GMT -5
Not much that I can say that hasn't already been said (other then comparisons to actions of oppressive dictatorships are a bit insane), but I will add if I can't stand one thing about festival management it is poor information. Festival goers need good, clear information about what is allowed, what isn't, and how the whole process for fans will be managed. The vagueness about cars being towed etc. only raises more questions. Poor information like this makes planning for attendees more difficult. If I can't visualize all the logistics of how I will get to and survive in a festival, I get really frustrated.
I feel for all of you with plans to go to Tent Only. I hope you are all able to make other arrangements if the new policy wrecked your current plans.
The more I think about this the more irate I get. They have been shrinkin' TO since I started comin' in 2007 I'm pretty sure. If you wanted to encourage Groop fine, but waitin' until now is unacceptable to make this change to TO policy. I'm gonna have to use the other contact addresses when I have some time in the next few days.
This^^ My complaint is this: Many people I know go to Bonnaroo BECAUSE of the TO experience. How many of you have done Camp Inforoo in TO before and thought it was amazing because you were around close Inforoo friends? To make this change this late in the game, after people have already made camping plans, travel arrangements and hell, even bought tickets for this years event, makes absolutely no sense. It would have been better to announce this WAY before, like during the early planning stages or during the pre-sale. I personally do not do TO (I get to use access), but my thought also switched to this: How many people will (or may) attempt to use accessible camping when they are not injured or need that service just because TO will not be an available option to them? That would SURELY be worse than any TO situation they have thought of....someone being forced out of access that needs it because of this fiasco scenario!
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I still don't understand how this is going to be enforced. Lets say I arrive late enough so I'm not in BFE (which will probably be quarantined like it was last year) and am still able to walk from my allotted spot to TO.
If I'm walking with my backpack and a tent in my hands, someone will stop me and say, "you aren't allowed to go to TO, you are in GA camping." I will then respond "I've been walking around here for hours. I'm exhausted and can't find TO. Can you point me in the right direction please?" How can they respond besides pointing me towards TO?
In terms of the towing cars...I don't see how they can possibly enforce that. It would take some balls to tow a car when I could have been a first timer that simply parked my car and "went exploring." Imagine the outcry if someone parks their car, goes walking around, then comes back and their car was towed b/c it didn't have a tent set up next to it.
Its quite easy.
1. RFID scans you 2. They open TO to pedestrians at 8pm on Wednesday. 3. You hire enough security to police those getting into TO until its 3/4 the way full
Now that you've guaranteed 3/4 of the folks in TO walked in, no more reason to monitor it, because those guys who have the gear at the car, there is no more room left for.
Its not that difficult logistically to do that. And if you throw in the quarantine to parking areas like they did last year till Thursday, you will have less time to worry about a invasion of car drivers.
I think you'll see security scanning wrist bands to TO until about noon on Thursday, then after that there is no need to secure something that's no longer there, space
Most folks were getting one person to save space in TO. But unless they tote in 5 tarps to cover ground and a tent, and plan on holding that space for a day, literally a day, its not going to work
Post by sillygreen89 on Apr 19, 2013 5:15:59 GMT -5
Conspiracy Theory: Bonnaroo is trying to get all of the traditional roosters out so they can jack ticket prices and drop musician quality/cost. They want a new breed of teenage rich dbags with excess money and a lack of appreciation for music, who go to roo so they can say they did. And from the reaction of this board and the few roo vets I usually go w/ this plan may work. Only mostly joking.
Disclaimer: I also think that far-right nutjobs are attempting to do the same w/ leftists/moderates America so they can run the country like this place.
On a different but similar note, I've always wished the camping space allocated to a car had some correspondence to how many people are in the car. Like if you had 1-3 people in the car, you got the standard 10' x 10', but if you had 4-6 people in the car, you got a 10' x 20' area or something. For Bonnaroo to keep touting itself as the "green" festival, they sure do discourage carpooling in this manner. Why would you want to carpool if it just means you'll be more cramped at the campsite. TO was one way to alleviate that. People could pack into a car to get to 'roo, then spread out a little bit at TO. Idk, not a big deal at this point, but just something I've always wondered about.
When some of us talked to an AC rep at Moogfest, this point was brought up. It always has seemed odd that they encourage car pooling, but don't really seem to recognize that it is difficult to put 4-6 people in a 10ft x width of your car area. Then again, we also talked about how Tent Only needed to be brought back to its former size, but we see how that turned out.
Am I the only person who is trying to imagine a giant tow truck trying to maneuver through the tiny rows??? Maybe they will use a crane. Lol.
No, thanks for failing. I'm still not sure what you are trying to say.
Not sure if serious. But, tow trucks are quite large and if they intend on towing the "abandoned" vehicle left by the GA campers who headed to TO off the farm anytime before late Sunday it would prove to be a difficult feat. Some of the rows are barely wide enough for a standard vehicle to maneuver out once everyone has been parked.
Given the timeframe and no reply from the powers that be perhaps it's time to flesh out Plan B? I think the brunch in Access sounds like a winner as its the only spot where we know Inforoo folks will be for sure. While not as ideal as everyone in TO we should create an arrival schedule for the board. That way folks arriving at different times can schedule meet up with other Inforoo folks and head in.
I am not sure the best way to handle the schedule but am willing to participate in figuring it out.
Kinda like groop camping without paying extra or dealing with them combining random groups.
Post by candyenchanted on Apr 19, 2013 8:37:22 GMT -5
I gotcha, roobee. It does seem like it would be difficult to get a tow truck in there and manage to tow a bunch of cars through the sea of craziness. But I doubt they've given that very much thought, and it probably IS an empty threat meant to worry us.
I honestly don't know how "Ashley Capps" isn't the big winner in Horn's "Who Will Ruin Bonnaroo in 2013?" thread. We should just shut it down and give him the trophy every year until he retires, like Michael Jordan winning MVP awards.
If that's the case we should just name the award:
"The Capps Trophy"
No one can outdo the master but we salute those that try
There are some hefty over-reactions in this thread...
Seriously, you all should turn on the damn news and realize not being able to place a tent on a specific patch of grass in Tennessee is not as big of a deal in the grand scheme of things.
On a different but similar note, I've always wished the camping space allocated to a car had some correspondence to how many people are in the car. Like if you had 1-3 people in the car, you got the standard 10' x 10', but if you had 4-6 people in the car, you got a 10' x 20' area or something. For Bonnaroo to keep touting itself as the "green" festival, they sure do discourage carpooling in this manner. Why would you want to carpool if it just means you'll be more cramped at the campsite. TO was one way to alleviate that. People could pack into a car to get to 'roo, then spread out a little bit at TO. Idk, not a big deal at this point, but just something I've always wondered about.
When some of us talked to an AC rep at Moogfest, this point was brought up. It always has seemed odd that they encourage car pooling, but don't really seem to recognize that it is difficult to put 4-6 people in a 10ft x width of your car area. Then again, we also talked about how Tent Only needed to be brought back to its former size, but we see how that turned out.
That's disappointing, but then again so is this whole situation.
There are some hefty over-reactions in this thread...
Seriously, you all should turn on the damn news and realize not being able to place a tent on a specific patch of grass in Tennessee is not as big of a deal in the grand scheme of things.
Current events have no bearing on this conversation, please dismount your high horse. Thanks.
Everyone keeps talking about tow trucks not being able to maneurver. I do not see this as them towing on Thursday at 11am. I see them towing on Wednsday and doing it the same way Walmart or other corporate places tow vehicles. Roo openly says TO is open on Wednsday, everyone now knows it will be full by Thursday. Roo brings 10 tow trucks that are paid on commission per car they tow which is standard. You fill only certain pods, i.e. BFE. People walk away from their cars toward TO with all their gear, the tow truck has a vested interest in towing that car out. Because it will be full by Thursday and you have GA contained to certain pods I really do not see how this is difficult to monitor. Will there be 100% success rate? Not even close. Will X% cars end up in impound? 100% guarantee.
By corporate places I mean they go into shared parking lots that have grocery stores, fast food joints, liquor stores and a walmart. They just watch where the people walk. If they walk from walmart parking lot to say Chipotle they tow. They do that without 300 pounds of gear. I think this is even easier to see people leaving their site then this example.
Last Edit: Apr 19, 2013 9:53:01 GMT -5 by Deleted - Back to Top
..I simply must disagree with you on that point.
