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Nirvana Alice In Chains Soundgraden Pearl Jam Hole?
And then you have these various supergroups like Stone Temple Pilots or whatever. Imo the HC voters should reconsider their vote..
Do you mean Temple of the Dog, or maybe Mad Season? Stone Temple Pilots weren't a super group. I would categorize them as grunge, though, along with Screaming Trees (criminally underrated, IMO), Mudhoney, TAD, the Melvins, L7, Babes in Toyland, Gruntruck, Love Battery, the Gits, and 7 Year Bitch, and I guess I'd probably throw Silverchair in there, too.
EDITED TO ADD: I forgot the Meat Puppets, who could potentially fit under the umbrella. And, of course, I left off the family tree-type stuff - Mother Love Bone, Green River, Bundle of Hiss, etc.
You're right, when it comes to what I should reference as to an artist's influences, it should be random Internet forum comments, and not, you know, words that have actually come out of the artist's mouth.
I didn't expect the idea that Kate Bush was an influence on Charli XCX to be so controversial. Here's Complex, from two years ago, talking about it:
It's not random but whatever, pop off with your one interview from ten years ago compared to the numerous instances she references the influences and music I was talking about. The Charli from ten years ago was still developping her sound, thinking that she wanted to be this big mega-pop star instead of doing her own thing. Furthermore, I think influences can def change over time. She might've been influenced by the fucking Cure and Kate Bush ten years ago, but why would she reference Brittney Spears now like all the time. Besides, it's not because a journalist here's "a clear Prince riff", that that is what she's referencing or whatever.
And idk why you link all these articles that either prove the influence on art pop queens like twigs or Polachek, that's not even on the matter or referencing back (see that Complex interview) to that one interview you already linked adding basically nothing to the discussion. Again, I'm not denying her influence. I just think it's very unlikely that 'now' that she 'is' doing hyperpop, or atleast was during the pandemic, that she was influenced by KB. I think the direct influence of SOPHIE, Cook, umru and by extention mid 2000's dance pop is much greater than Kate Bush.
You're right, when it comes to what I should reference as to an artist's influences, it should be random Internet forum comments, and not, you know, words that have actually come out of the artist's mouth.
I didn't expect the idea that Kate Bush was an influence on Charli XCX to be so controversial. Here's Complex, from two years ago, talking about it:
It's not random but whatever, pop off with your one interview from ten years ago compared to the numerous instances she references the influences and music I was talking about. The Charli from ten years ago was still developping her sound, thinking that she wanted to be this big mega-pop star instead of doing her own thing. Furthermore, I think influences can def change over time. She might've been influenced by the fucking Cure and Kate Bush ten years ago, but why would she reference Brittney Spears now like all the time. Besides, it's not because a journalist here's "a clear Prince riff", that that is what she's referencing or whatever.
And idk why you link all these articles that either prove the influence on art pop queens like twigs or Polachek, that's not even on the matter or referencing back (see that Complex interview) to that one interview you already linked adding basically nothing to the discussion. Again, I'm not denying her influence. I just think it's very unlikely that 'now' that she 'is' doing hyperpop, or atleast was during the pandemic, that she was influenced by KB. I think the direct influence of SOPHIE, Cook, umru and by extention mid 2000's dance pop is much greater than Kate Bush.
This is so weird; I'm really not sure what the conflict is, here. It seems like we're saying the same thing: Charli XCX was at least *in part* influenced by Kate Bush - I never said she was *only* influenced by Kate Bush. That'd be nuts. Most artists incorporate a bunch of influences in their work. I do agree with that Complex article that the way in which KB pushed pop production forward helped set the stage for artists like Charli, SOPHIE, and others in what's considered hyperpop who are doing the same thing now. I really don't think that's a "pop off" sort of statement, but maybe I'm wrong?
Anyway, I'll let it lie. I'm going to keep believing the work of Kate Bush had an impact on some of the more popular hyperpop artists today, but if you don't want to, that's totally cool with me!
Lol. Come on man, that’s just part of it. Hair bands literally called out Soundgarden for replacing them in rock consciousness in the VH1 production of top 100 hard bands. I didn’t make the argument you presented, but there was a lot that went into the changeover. Chili Peppers were a big part of it too. And thrash. We didn’t even really call it grunge that much early on. It was hard rock or subpop or whatever.
It's by far the biggest part of it. Nevermind has sold 7 times as many copies as Superunknown. It's widely considered to have spurred the rise of alternative rock. None of this is controversial. I never said Soundgarden weren't also around.
The "looking back perspective" thing you said is condescending and anti-historic. All of this was true at the time.
It’s not supposed to be condescending. I felt like they had the most influence on ditching fashion and bringing an anarchist approach to life in the mainstream than we as hardcore people only found within our scenes 5-10 years earlier. Massive credit for their influences.
There was literally an assload of events in culture and music that helped the changeover. Nirvana was the closest of the Seattle bands to punk, and lots of us saw them as a punk at the time. There’s no argument that Smells Like Teen Spirit video didn’t change minds about fashion and glam poseur shit. It was an updated throwback to the mid 80’s. If you want to go weeds in the history, Nevermind was 1991 along with Blood Sugar, Badmotorfinger and Pearl Jam 10 all second half of that year. Rap had been on the rise as well as some gangster rap. Jane’s was big doing their rockstar shit. Thrash had emerged from endless touring, and plenty of that came together as something new and better. Life was changing just as popular rock had. 1992 came and was the most tumultuous year of upheaval I recall in my life (was too small in ‘68)
I wouldn’t recommend you watch it but there are direct references to Soundgarden (since they were heavy) replacing hair metal in VJ rotation. Lita Ford seemed the most butthurt over it. Some poseur shit in leather is now replaced by Rusty Cage, Outshined, Jesus Christ Pose, Alive, Smells Like Teen Spirit obviously videos like Man in a Box and Hunger Strike pretty soon after if not right around then. And I think they are also singled out Soundgarden because they did heavy without the gimmicks (edit of hair metal)
Nirvana Alice In Chains Soundgraden Pearl Jam Hole?
And then you have these various supergroups like Stone Temple Pilots or whatever. Imo the HC voters should reconsider their vote..
Do you mean Temple of the Dog, or maybe Mad Season? Stone Temple Pilots weren't a super group. I would categorize them as grunge, though, along with Screaming Trees (criminally underrated, IMO), Mudhoney, TAD, the Melvins, L7, Babes in Toyland, Gruntruck, Love Battery, the Gits, and 7 Year Bitch, and I guess I'd probably throw Silverchair in there, too.
EDITED TO ADD: I forgot the Meat Puppets, who could potentially fit under the umbrella. And, of course, I left off the family tree-type stuff - Mother Love Bone, Green River, Bundle of Hiss, etc.
Nirvana Alice In Chains Soundgraden Pearl Jam Hole?
And then you have these various supergroups like Stone Temple Pilots or whatever. Imo the HC voters should reconsider their vote..
Do you mean Temple of the Dog, or maybe Mad Season? Stone Temple Pilots weren't a super group. I would categorize them as grunge, though, along with Screaming Trees (criminally underrated, IMO), Mudhoney, TAD, the Melvins, L7, Babes in Toyland, Gruntruck, Love Battery, the Gits, and 7 Year Bitch, and I guess I'd probably throw Silverchair in there, too.
EDITED TO ADD: I forgot the Meat Puppets, who could potentially fit under the umbrella. And, of course, I left off the family tree-type stuff - Mother Love Bone, Green River, Bundle of Hiss, etc.
Meat puppets were their own thing but go way back to the hardcore era. They also had a couple songs played during college rock era. They fit into a lot of possible categories.
It's by far the biggest part of it. Nevermind has sold 7 times as many copies as Superunknown. It's widely considered to have spurred the rise of alternative rock. None of this is controversial. I never said Soundgarden weren't also around.
The "looking back perspective" thing you said is condescending and anti-historic. All of this was true at the time.
I can’t imagine a world where someone could listen to In Utero, Ten, Superunknown, Purple, MC&TIS, and Frogstomp and not appreciate every single drop of it. Much less put genres like “hyperpop” ahead of it. The only argument would be the case that grunge/alternative and hyperpop/pop should be combined since they are subgenres/genres.
I can’t imagine a world where someone could listen to In Utero, Ten, Superunknown, Purple, MC&TIS, and Frogstomp and not appreciate every single drop of it. Much less put genres like “hyperpop” ahead of it. The only argument would be the case that grunge/alternative and hyperpop/pop should be combined since they are subgenres/genres.
Honestly, I think there’s a big dropoff after those first three. You do grunge a disservice here.
I can’t imagine a world where someone could listen to In Utero, Ten, Superunknown, Purple, MC&TIS, and Frogstomp and not appreciate every single drop of it. Much less put genres like “hyperpop” ahead of it. The only argument would be the case that grunge/alternative and hyperpop/pop should be combined since they are subgenres/genres.
Honestly, I think there’s a big dropoff after those first three. You do grunge a disservice here.
I was giving a sampling, but all of those hold up extremely well in my book.
Post by jorgeandthekraken on Jul 31, 2022 18:05:46 GMT -5
Ambient voters go to folk, country voters go to techno, jazz voter go to R&B, then you and the other R&B voter go to Metal, and Classical voter go to hip-hop, Classic Rock, or Psych.
Ambient voters go to folk, country voters go to techno, jazz voter go to R&B, then you and the other R&B voter go to Metal, and Classical voter go to hip-hop, Classic Rock, or Psych.
